Re: SPSSX-L Digest - 14 Nov 2019 to 15 Nov 2019 (#2019-237)
Posted by
Jon Peck on
Nov 16, 2019; 2:41pm
URL: http://spssx-discussion.165.s1.nabble.com/Roots-tp5738554p5738565.html
I should have looked at the SAS operator precedence table first. Sure enough, the minus would be evaluated after the exponentiation if parentheses are not used.
Priority Order of Evaluation Symbols MnemonicEquivalent Definition Example
Group I right to left ** (table note 1)
exponentiation
y=a**2;
+ (table note 2)
positive prefix
y=+(a+b);
-
negative prefix
z=-(a+b);
SAS may prioritize - lower than **. Try it as
x = (-1)**(1/3);
On Sat, Nov 16, 2019 at 7:15 AM Eugene Komaroff <
[hidden email]> wrote:
SAS returned the correct answer:
x = -1**(1/3) = -1;
Eugene
On Sat, Nov 16, 2019 at 12:00 AM SPSSX-L automatic digest system <
[hidden email]> wrote:
There are 7 messages totaling 551 lines in this issue.
Topics of the day:
1. Roots (6)
2. Map conversion utility problems
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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2019 12:12:20 +0300
From: Kirill Orlov <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Roots
See DOMAIN ERRORS paragraph in Command Syntax Reference.
15.11.2019 4:53, Stan Gorodenski пишет:
> compute z = (-1)**(1/3).
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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2019 08:27:29 -0700
From: ChrisKeran <[hidden email]>
Subject: Map conversion utility problems
I'm trying to use the Map Conversion Utility, however it seems to take 10
minutes to refresh.
Also, when I select the "Delete individual elements" task, it doesn't show
the list of elements to delete, and doesn't seem to allow me to select the
element on the map preview. Thoughts?
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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2019 08:36:17 -0700
From: Stan Gorodenski <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Roots
Thanks. I did not know this paragraph existed. However, all it did was
tell me that SPSS cannot carry out the compute, which I already knew,
but not why. All the domain errors they list, I believe, except
(-1)**(1/3) and a number too large to be represented in the computer,
are not mathematically defined and so I would not expect SPSS to be able
to carry out a calculation. However, (-1)**(1/3) is mathematically
defined. I tried this on my HP 35s hand calculator and it came up with
an error. This did not seem unreasonable because this is an inexpensive
calculating machine. I then went to SPSS, a more advanced software, and
discovered SPSS cannot do it either. Does anyone know why? Is it not
possible with the language upon which SPSS is based? I wonder if SAS can
do it. Does anyone know?
Stan
On 11/15/2019 2:12 AM, Kirill Orlov wrote:
> See DOMAIN ERRORS paragraph in Command Syntax Reference.
>
>
> 15.11.2019 4:53, Stan Gorodenski пишет:
>> compute z = (-1)**(1/3).
>
>
>
>
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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2019 09:35:01 -0700
From: Bruce Weaver <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Roots
https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/en/SSLVMB_26.0.0/statistics_reference_project_ddita/spss/base/syn_transformation_expressions_domain_errors.html
Kirill Orlov wrote
> See DOMAIN ERRORS paragraph in Command Syntax Reference.
>
>
> 15.11.2019 4:53, Stan Gorodenski пишет:
>> compute z = (-1)**(1/3).
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
> LISTSERV@.UGA
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--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
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"When all else fails, RTFM."
NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
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Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2019 17:05:05 +0000
From: Rich Ulrich <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Roots
I wonder - Is there any demand for the exception-coding
that would be necessary? How many people write code
where they want to take the fractional root of a negative
number, where the fraction is the reciprocal of an odd integer?
( Note, the fraction cannot be expressed EXACTLY on a binary
computer. How is that accommodated?)
The natural programming solution to non-integer roots is
to use logs. I suppose if there is an area where the problem
comes up, specialized programs for that area might do it.
I suspect the efficient solution might use a special subroutine
call rather than an in-line expression.
--
Rich Ulrich
________________________________
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion <[hidden email]> on behalf of Bruce Weaver <[hidden email]>
Sent: Friday, November 15, 2019 11:35 AM
To: [hidden email] <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Roots
https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/en/SSLVMB_26.0.0/statistics_reference_project_ddita/spss/base/syn_transformation_expressions_domain_errors.html
Kirill Orlov wrote
> See DOMAIN ERRORS paragraph in Command Syntax Reference.
>
>
> 15.11.2019 4:53, Stan Gorodenski пишет:
>> compute z = (-1)**(1/3).
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
> LISTSERV@.UGA
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> INFO REFCARD
-----
--
Bruce Weaver
[hidden email]
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
"When all else fails, RTFM."
NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
--
Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2019 12:15:09 -0500
From: David Greenberg <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Roots
I tried it in Stata. the command display (-.3333)^(1/3) produces an
error message. Removing the second set of parentheses yields -.3333.
David Greenberg, NYU Sociology Dept.
On Fri, Nov 15, 2019 at 10:37 AM Stan Gorodenski <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Thanks. I did not know this paragraph existed. However, all it did was
> tell me that SPSS cannot carry out the compute, which I already knew,
> but not why. All the domain errors they list, I believe, except
> (-1)**(1/3) and a number too large to be represented in the computer,
> are not mathematically defined and so I would not expect SPSS to be able
> to carry out a calculation. However, (-1)**(1/3) is mathematically
> defined. I tried this on my HP 35s hand calculator and it came up with
> an error. This did not seem unreasonable because this is an inexpensive
> calculating machine. I then went to SPSS, a more advanced software, and
> discovered SPSS cannot do it either. Does anyone know why? Is it not
> possible with the language upon which SPSS is based? I wonder if SAS can
> do it. Does anyone know?
> Stan
>
> On 11/15/2019 2:12 AM, Kirill Orlov wrote:
> > See DOMAIN ERRORS paragraph in Command Syntax Reference.
> >
> >
> > 15.11.2019 4:53, Stan Gorodenski пишет:
> >> compute z = (-1)**(1/3).
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
> [hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> command. To leave the list, send the command
> SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
> For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
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------------------------------
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 2019 10:26:33 -0700
From: Stan Gorodenski <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: Roots
I don't know if there is any demand, but I think the square root of -1
is used in electronics. I'm not into this so I really don't know. I did
not pose this question because I have an application for it. I was just
curious since it seems that sophisticated software packages like SPSS
and SAS should be able to do it. I just sent an email to join the SAS
discussion group and will ask them if SAS can do it. I suppose one could
write a routine to return a -1 if the the denominator of the exponent is
an odd number.
Stan
On 11/15/2019 10:05 AM, Rich Ulrich wrote:
> I wonder - Is there any demand for the exception-coding
> that would be necessary? How many people write code
> where they want to take the fractional root of a negative
> number, where the fraction is the reciprocal of an odd integer?
> ( Note, the fraction cannot be expressed EXACTLY on a binary
> computer. How is that accommodated?)
>
> The natural programming solution to non-integer roots is
> to use logs. I suppose if there is an area where the problem
> comes up, specialized programs for that area might do it.
> I suspect the efficient solution might use a special subroutine
> call rather than an in-line expression.
>
> --
> Rich Ulrich
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> *From:* SPSSX(r) Discussion <[hidden email]> on behalf of
> Bruce Weaver <[hidden email]>
> *Sent:* Friday, November 15, 2019 11:35 AM
> *To:* [hidden email] <[hidden email]>
> *Subject:* Re: Roots
> https://www.ibm.com/support/knowledgecenter/en/SSLVMB_26.0.0/statistics_reference_project_ddita/spss/base/syn_transformation_expressions_domain_errors.html
>
>
>
> Kirill Orlov wrote
> > See DOMAIN ERRORS paragraph in Command Syntax Reference.
> >
> >
> > 15.11.2019 4:53, Stan Gorodenski пишет:
> >> compute z = (-1)**(1/3).
> >
> > =====================
> > To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
> > LISTSERV@.UGA
>
> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
> > command. To leave the list, send the command
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> > For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
> > INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> --
> Bruce Weaver
> [hidden email]
> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>
> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>
> --
> Sent from: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/
>
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End of SPSSX-L Digest - 14 Nov 2019 to 15 Nov 2019 (#2019-237)
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