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Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

John F Hall
Marta
 
Have you thought about joining their academic author program?  it won't help your university, but it might give you a free licence, on condition that you don't use it for personal gain and send copies of everything to SPSS.  How do you think a retired guy on a fractional pension like me manages to get access to SPSS?  If they pull the plug I'll be in cold turkey for ever!
 
John
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 8:04 PM
Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM


John F Hall escribió:
> If we all club together, could we buy 11 outright?  It does everything
> I need.  $5 a head should be enough, or maybe $10 for 15?  I've still
> got a 1980s version of PC+ on an old machine upstairs, will that do?
SPSS 11 would not work for me. My macros use several datasets at the
same time (DATASET DECLARE, DATASET ACTIVATE...). I would need SPSS 15
(because I definitely don't like SPSS 14), although I must confess that
I was happy enough with SPSS 13, the one I used prior to upgrading to
SPSS 15.

C'mon, "us.ibm.com" people, say something... could we have SPSS 15 as a
cheap home version? could we, could we, could we? pleeeease?

Marta GG
(feeling too old to start learning Stata from scratch)

--
For miscellaneous SPSS related statistical stuff, visit:
http://gjyp.nl/marta/

=====================
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Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

J. R. Carroll
Typed this right as John's email came through regarding the "academic author program":
I know that the SPSS/PSAW software package thrives on the licenses it sells, and that they share a nice piece of the education market (at least from the universities I have visited in recent years). However, IBM has been pretty smart in the past about letting educational entities have 'free' or 'discounted' equipment/software in the hope of training the next generation of users/buyers.  Take for instance IBM Mainframe - from my understanding the full system can cost a pretty penny (as well as the upkeep etc) and from what I heard (maybe just rumor) but IBM equipped my university with a free one... why? Because, our university trains computer technicians to work on them.  I think that this has been the reasoning/impetus behind the student/grad pack versions of SPSS, but even those can be relatively expensive (especially because some students are cajoled into the student version, then the grad version, and then the full version - and let's not forget the renewal fees); overall SPSS has been generous in some regards, but with the recent acclimation of SPSS into the IBM-fold, I hope it follows suit and they develop a stronger/cheaper and more competitive SPSS package for the education system.

John, 

I'll be looking into it myself to get the details, but what exactly can you do with the academic author license/program (this is the first time I've heard of it)?  i.e. who is it designed/made for?  Does it include the full SPSS suite?  Can you do research with it?  etc.

J. R. Carroll
Grad. Student in Pre-Doc Psychology at CSUS
Research Assistant for Just About Everyone.
Email:  [hidden email]   -or-   [hidden email]
Phone:  (916) 628-4204


2010/8/2 John F Hall <[hidden email]>
Marta
 
Have you thought about joining their academic author program?  it won't help your university, but it might give you a free licence, on condition that you don't use it for personal gain and send copies of everything to SPSS.  How do you think a retired guy on a fractional pension like me manages to get access to SPSS?  If they pull the plug I'll be in cold turkey for ever!
 
John
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 8:04 PM
Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM


John F Hall escribió:
> If we all club together, could we buy 11 outright?  It does everything
> I need.  $5 a head should be enough, or maybe $10 for 15?  I've still
> got a 1980s version of PC+ on an old machine upstairs, will that do?
SPSS 11 would not work for me. My macros use several datasets at the
same time (DATASET DECLARE, DATASET ACTIVATE...). I would need SPSS 15
(because I definitely don't like SPSS 14), although I must confess that
I was happy enough with SPSS 13, the one I used prior to upgrading to
SPSS 15.

C'mon, "us.ibm.com" people, say something... could we have SPSS 15 as a
cheap home version? could we, could we, could we? pleeeease?

Marta GG
(feeling too old to start learning Stata from scratch)

--
For miscellaneous SPSS related statistical stuff, visit:
http://gjyp.nl/marta/

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD


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Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

John F Hall
Justin
 
I was put on to this by George Argyrous (one of the authors on the list of recommended SPSS textbooks on my site) when my 5-year licence for SPSS11 expired in 2006.   Check it out on  http://www.spss.com/media/collateral/academic-authors-program.pdf  and http://www.spss.com/vertical_markets/education/textbooks.htm
 
Basically I offered to review Julie Pallants' SPSS Survival Manual for the Social Research Association (UK) but when it arrived I discovered to my horror that it was for SPSS for Windows and only used the GUI.  I had only ever used a mainframe version in syntax and only had a DOS based PC with WordStar4.  My son lent me a PC with Windows and Word:  Major Lester (SPSS UK) wangled me an evaluation version of the Windows version of SPSS 11 via SPSS France.  I learned Windows, Word and PowerPoint in double quick time and got the 5-year licence free from SPSS France on the strength of my extensive critical review of Pallant 2001 (there's a different review of her 2005 edition there as well): long story, but it's all in my Old Dog, Old Tricks presentation to ASSESS (European SPSS users) at York University in 2006.
 
Finding myself with a spare 5 years of SPSS 11, I started to convert and update all the teaching materials from the postgraduate (part-time evening) Survey Analysis Workshop I designed and taught from 1976 to 1992 when, fed up with vindictive and malevolent senior management and no longer willing to spend any more years banging my head against a brick wall, I took early retirement.  All my course materials needed to be converted from WordStar4 to Word and from SPSS-X 3 for a Vax cluster to SPSS for Windows on a PC.  Hence the offer to do the Old Dog thing at York.  When licence renewal time came (it's every six months) SPSS couldn't or wouldn't give me a renewal code foor 11, so I had to have 15.  When that expired after two or three cycles, they gave me 18, but luckily 15 is still maintained so I managed to get a renewal code for that as well.  Thus I find myself with both 15 and 18, but although I have an extensive set of tutorials up on the site now, I still have a lot to do. 
 
The academic author program is for authors of textbooks, but they seem happy to accept my on-line tutorials as well.  They're all syntax-based in preference to menus, but many of the examples are also shown with the GUI as well (thus demonstrating the clear superiority and speed of syntax).  Moreover they're written with no maths and gentle step by step progression, in research logic order, and have full colour screenshots at each step: no textbooks do that yet.  You can check the sequence on the Summary guide to SPSS/PASW 18 tutorials
 
The rest of the site is given over to material on the main surveys I have been involved in over the years, especially the Quality of Life in Britain series I did with Mark Abrams at the SSRC Survey Unit, and includes various (not easily available if at all) working papers, reports, questionnaires etc.
 
That's probably enough for now: nearly bed-time here.  I've been on the computer nearly all day and need to relax a bit (ie fall asleep in front of TV leaving best part of a pint of English ale to go cling-filmed in fridge overnight).
 
Best
 
John
 
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 8:30 PM
Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

Typed this right as John's email came through regarding the "academic author program":
I know that the SPSS/PSAW software package thrives on the licenses it sells, and that they share a nice piece of the education market (at least from the universities I have visited in recent years). However, IBM has been pretty smart in the past about letting educational entities have 'free' or 'discounted' equipment/software in the hope of training the next generation of users/buyers.  Take for instance IBM Mainframe - from my understanding the full system can cost a pretty penny (as well as the upkeep etc) and from what I heard (maybe just rumor) but IBM equipped my university with a free one... why? Because, our university trains computer technicians to work on them.  I think that this has been the reasoning/impetus behind the student/grad pack versions of SPSS, but even those can be relatively expensive (especially because some students are cajoled into the student version, then the grad version, and then the full version - and let's not forget the renewal fees); overall SPSS has been generous in some regards, but with the recent acclimation of SPSS into the IBM-fold, I hope it follows suit and they develop a stronger/cheaper and more competitive SPSS package for the education system.

John, 

I'll be looking into it myself to get the details, but what exactly can you do with the academic author license/program (this is the first time I've heard of it)?  i.e. who is it designed/made for?  Does it include the full SPSS suite?  Can you do research with it?  etc.

J. R. Carroll
Grad. Student in Pre-Doc Psychology at CSUS
Research Assistant for Just About Everyone.
Email:  [hidden email]   -or-   [hidden email]
Phone:  (916) 628-4204


2010/8/2 John F Hall <[hidden email]>
Marta
 
Have you thought about joining their academic author program?  it won't help your university, but it might give you a free licence, on condition that you don't use it for personal gain and send copies of everything to SPSS.  How do you think a retired guy on a fractional pension like me manages to get access to SPSS?  If they pull the plug I'll be in cold turkey for ever!
 
John
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, August 02, 2010 8:04 PM
Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM


John F Hall escribió:
> If we all club together, could we buy 11 outright?  It does everything
> I need.  $5 a head should be enough, or maybe $10 for 15?  I've still
> got a 1980s version of PC+ on an old machine upstairs, will that do?
SPSS 11 would not work for me. My macros use several datasets at the
same time (DATASET DECLARE, DATASET ACTIVATE...). I would need SPSS 15
(because I definitely don't like SPSS 14), although I must confess that
I was happy enough with SPSS 13, the one I used prior to upgrading to
SPSS 15.

C'mon, "us.ibm.com" people, say something... could we have SPSS 15 as a
cheap home version? could we, could we, could we? pleeeease?

Marta GG
(feeling too old to start learning Stata from scratch)

--
For miscellaneous SPSS related statistical stuff, visit:
http://gjyp.nl/marta/

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD


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Interaction between SPSS v18 and ArcView 10 -- python issue

Bibel, Daniel (POL)
In reply to this post by SR Millis-3
Don't know if anyone on this list can help - but it is worth a try.

I've got SPSS v18 with the python plug in installed. Python 2.6 is the
version that SPSS has installed I believe, in the c:\python26
subdirectory.

ArcView v10 installs python 2.6.5 and be default places it in the
'python26' subdirectory.  This SPSS does not like, and when running a
command file that invokes python, I get a 'begin program' message and
the processor just sits there.

I've uninstalled the python 2.6.5 that ArcView installed and SPSS works
with no problem.

I then reinstalled ArcView and specified a different subdirectory for
python (python265) but again have the same problem with SPSS.

Is there something I can look at/for which anyone on this list might
suggest?

Thanks for any assistance!

Dan Bibel
Massachusetts State Police

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
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Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

Yves_Therriault
In reply to this post by Marta Garcia-Granero

  From: Marta García-Granero <[hidden email]>
 Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM
 To: [hidden email]
 Date: Monday, August 2, 2010, 2:53 AM
> Hi everybody:


(...)

>I'm really sad to have to stop using SPSS after 2011. I have been a SPSS
>user for 20 years, but I will not be able to afford one individual
>license for myself after the University switches to Stata. I really wish
>there was a inexpensive home version of SPSS I could by for private use.
>SPSS 15 deserves being saved from extinction.

>Best regards,
>Marta GG

>(soon a Stata user)

Hello everybody,

I have been using SPSS for more than 20 years too. I still have the old SPSS 12.01 (or PASW ?) version. I'm working as a research analyst in public health for a governmental organisation. Considering that it would cost my organisation a few thousand dollars to upgrade all my modules for the newest version (PASW 18), I will probably switch to Stata in the coming months.

The costs aren't the only factor I'm taking into account. Having tested an evaluation version of Stata more than one year ago, I find that it seems to be far more superior to SPSS in many ways. Moreover, it's a "complete" package. Stata Corp doesn't sell its software into different expensive add-on modules! The integration of Stata with the internet is fantastic. It's possible to update the software by typing "update all" on the command line without having to login to the Stata Web site. (Maybe, PASW 18.0 is working this way as well, I don't know).

Of course, I will have to learn a new syntax. Even though the logic is similar, this wll require a lot of time an effort (for example, we have to keep in mind that Stata considers a missing numerical value as "infinite", which may be rather tricky when we recode a variable). But I think the end result will be worth the trouble even though, like Marta, I'm feeling a little bit too old to learn Stata from scratch. I have bought 3 introductory books in order to learn the basics of Stata more easily.

I never really understood the policy of SPSS to sell its software into expensive add-on modules. I'd like to understand why is Stata capable to sell "a complete" package at $1500 US (Stata IC version - a flavour of Stata that would quite suit my needs) while my organisation would have to spend about $4000 or $5000 to buy the last release of SPSS that would offer the same capabilities?

I totally agree with those of you who are saying that SPSS will probably lose future clients if universities can't afford to purchase SPSS anymore to teach statistics. More and more students will have to learn Stata or something else. I may be wrong, but I have the strange impression that SPSS isn't aware of this. SPSS seems to put all its efforts into developing "predictive analysis" for big business or big corporations!

I have been a SPSS fan since the beginning of my career (from the old days of SPSS PC + on DOS). The switch won't be easy, but do I have a choice?

Kind regards to you all,

Yves Therriault, Ph. D.
Agent de recherche
Surveillance de l'état de santé de la population
Direction de la santé publique (Service en surveillance et évaluation)
Agence de la santé et des services sociaux de la Côte-Nord (Province de Québec, Canada)
Courriel : [hidden email]

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Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

Bruce Weaver
Administrator
Yves_Therriault wrote
--- snip ---

Hello everybody,

I have been using SPSS for more than 20 years too. I still have the old
SPSS 12.01 (or PASW ?) version. I'm working as a research analyst in public
health for a governmental organisation. Considering that it would cost my
organisation a few thousand dollars to upgrade all my modules for the
newest version (PASW 18), I will probably switch to Stata in the coming
months.

The costs aren't the only factor I'm taking into account. Having tested an
evaluation version of Stata more than one year ago, I find that it seems to
be far more superior to SPSS in many ways. Moreover, it's a "complete"
package. Stata Corp doesn't sell its software into different expensive
add-on modules! The integration of Stata with the internet is fantastic.
It's possible to update the software by typing "update all" on the command
line without having to login to the Stata Web site. (Maybe, PASW 18.0  is
working this way as well, I don't know).

Of course, I will have to learn a new syntax. Even though the logic is
similar, this wll require a lot of time an effort (for example, we have to
keep in mind that Stata considers a missing numerical value as "infinite",
which may be rather tricky when we recode a variable). But I think the end
result will be worth the trouble even though, like Marta, I'm feeling a
little bit too old to learn Stata from scratch. I have bought 3
introductory books in order to learn the basics of Stata more easily.

I never really understood the policy of SPSS to sell its software into
expensive add-on modules. I'd like to understand why is Stata capable to
sell "a complete" package at $1500 US (Stata IC version - a flavour of
Stata that would quite suit my needs) while my organisation would have to
spend about $4000 or $5000 to buy the last release of SPSS that would offer
the same capabilities?

--- snip ---
For those who are in a university setting, the prices can be a lot lower than that.  If your university is part of the GradPlan, you can get a perpetual license for Stata IC/11 for $179 (USD).  For more info, see:

   http://www.stata.com/order/new/edu/gradplan.html

--
Bruce Weaver
bweaver@lakeheadu.ca
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

PLEASE NOTE THE FOLLOWING: 
1. My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly. To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
2. The SPSSX Discussion forum on Nabble is no longer linked to the SPSSX-L listserv administered by UGA (https://listserv.uga.edu/).
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Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

John F Hall
In reply to this post by Yves_Therriault
Yves
 
Je suis complètement d'accord. mais je crois que c'est IBM qui s'en fichent, pas SPSS.  Ils ont leurs actinnaires à soigner, pas nous.
 
(I agree completely, but I think it's IBM who don't care, not SPSS.  They ahve their shareholders to think of, not us.)
 
John
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, August 03, 2010 8:44 PM
Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

  From: Marta García-Granero <[hidden email]>
 Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM
 To: [hidden email]
 Date: Monday, August 2, 2010, 2:53 AM
> Hi everybody:


(...)

>I'm really sad to have to stop using SPSS after 2011. I have been a SPSS
>user for 20 years, but I will not be able to afford one individual
>license for myself after the University switches to Stata. I really wish
>there was a inexpensive home version of SPSS I could by for private use.
>SPSS 15 deserves being saved from extinction.

>Best regards,
>Marta GG

>(soon a Stata user)

Hello everybody,

I have been using SPSS for more than 20 years too. I still have the old SPSS 12.01 (or PASW ?) version. I'm working as a research analyst in public health for a governmental organisation. Considering that it would cost my organisation a few thousand dollars to upgrade all my modules for the newest version (PASW 18), I will probably switch to Stata in the coming months.

The costs aren't the only factor I'm taking into account. Having tested an evaluation version of Stata more than one year ago, I find that it seems to be far more superior to SPSS in many ways. Moreover, it's a "complete" package. Stata Corp doesn't sell its software into different expensive add-on modules! The integration of Stata with the internet is fantastic. It's possible to update the software by typing "update all" on the command line without having to login to the Stata Web site. (Maybe, PASW 18.0 is working this way as well, I don't know).

Of course, I will have to learn a new syntax. Even though the logic is similar, this wll require a lot of time an effort (for example, we have to keep in mind that Stata considers a missing numerical value as "infinite", which may be rather tricky when we recode a variable). But I think the end result will be worth the trouble even though, like Marta, I'm feeling a little bit too old to learn Stata from scratch. I have bought 3 introductory books in order to learn the basics of Stata more easily.

I never really understood the policy of SPSS to sell its software into expensive add-on modules. I'd like to understand why is Stata capable to sell "a complete" package at $1500 US (Stata IC version - a flavour of Stata that would quite suit my needs) while my organisation would have to spend about $4000 or $5000 to buy the last release of SPSS that would offer the same capabilities?

I totally agree with those of you who are saying that SPSS will probably lose future clients if universities can't afford to purchase SPSS anymore to teach statistics. More and more students will have to learn Stata or something else. I may be wrong, but I have the strange impression that SPSS isn't aware of this. SPSS seems to put all its efforts into developing "predictive analysis" for big business or big corporations!

I have been a SPSS fan since the beginning of my career (from the old days of SPSS PC + on DOS). The switch won't be easy, but do I have a choice?

Kind regards to you all,

Yves Therriault, Ph. D.
Agent de recherche
Surveillance de l'état de santé de la population
Direction de la santé publique (Service en surveillance et évaluation)
Agence de la santé et des services sociaux de la Côte-Nord (Province de Québec, Canada)
Courriel : [hidden email]

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Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

SR Millis-3
In reply to this post by Yves_Therriault
Although I personally prefer to with with Stata with its command line language commands, Stata also comes with its own point-and-click GUI.
 
Scott Millis

~~~~~~~~~~~
Scott R Millis, PhD, ABPP, CStat, CSci
Professor & Director of Research
Dept of Physical Medicine & Rehabilitation
Dept of Emergency Medicine
Wayne State University School of Medicine
261 Mack Blvd
Detroit, MI 48201
Email: [hidden email]
Email: [hidden email]
Tel: 313-993-8085
Fax: 313-966-7682

--- On Tue, 8/3/10, Yves Therriault <[hidden email]> wrote:

From: Yves Therriault <[hidden email]>
Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM
To: [hidden email]
Date: Tuesday, August 3, 2010, 2:44 PM

  From: Marta García-Granero <[hidden email]>
 Subject: Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM
 To: [hidden email]
 Date: Monday, August 2, 2010, 2:53 AM
> Hi everybody:


(...)

>I'm really sad to have to stop using SPSS after 2011. I have been a SPSS
>user for 20 years, but I will not be able to afford one individual
>license for myself after the University switches to Stata. I really wish
>there was a inexpensive home version of SPSS I could by for private use.
>SPSS 15 deserves being saved from extinction.

>Best regards,
>Marta GG

>(soon a Stata user)

Hello everybody,

I have been using SPSS for more than 20 years too. I still have the old SPSS 12.01 (or PASW ?) version. I'm working as a research analyst in public health for a governmental organisation. Considering that it would cost my organisation a few thousand dollars to upgrade all my modules for the newest version (PASW 18), I will probably switch to Stata in the coming months.

The costs aren't the only factor I'm taking into account. Having tested an evaluation version of Stata more than one year ago, I find that it seems to be far more superior to SPSS in many ways. Moreover, it's a "complete" package. Stata Corp doesn't sell its software into different expensive add-on modules! The integration of Stata with the internet is fantastic. It's possible to update the software by typing "update all" on the command line without having to login to the Stata Web site. (Maybe, PASW 18.0 is working this way as well, I don't know).

Of course, I will have to learn a new syntax. Even though the logic is similar, this wll require a lot of time an effort (for example, we have to keep in mind that Stata considers a missing numerical value as "infinite", which may be rather tricky when we recode a variable). But I think the end result will be worth the trouble even though, like Marta, I'm feeling a little bit too old to learn Stata from scratch. I have bought 3 introductory books in order to learn the basics of Stata more easily.

I never really understood the policy of SPSS to sell its software into expensive add-on modules. I'd like to understand why is Stata capable to sell "a complete" package at $1500 US (Stata IC version - a flavour of Stata that would quite suit my needs) while my organisation would have to spend about $4000 or $5000 to buy the last release of SPSS that would offer the same capabilities?

I totally agree with those of you who are saying that SPSS will probably lose future clients if universities can't afford to purchase SPSS anymore to teach statistics. More and more students will have to learn Stata or something else. I may be wrong, but I have the strange impression that SPSS isn't aware of this. SPSS seems to put all its efforts into developing "predictive analysis" for big business or big corporations!

I have been a SPSS fan since the beginning of my career (from the old days of SPSS PC + on DOS). The switch won't be easy, but do I have a choice?

Kind regards to you all,

Yves Therriault, Ph. D.
Agent de recherche
Surveillance de l'état de santé de la population
Direction de la santé publique (Service en surveillance et évaluation)
Agence de la santé et des services sociaux de la Côte-Nord (Province de Québec, Canada)
Courriel : [hidden email]
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6 point variable

Jarrod Teo-2
In reply to this post by Bibel, Daniel (POL)
Hi all,
 
I will like to ask if the following variable can be classified as a likert scale variable for 2-indepedent t-test or correlation usage.
 
1-Strongly Disagree
2-Disagree
3-Somewhat Disagree
4-Somewhat Agree
5-Agree
6-Strongly Agree
 
If this variable is not considered as one, can I recode the somewhat disagree and somewhat agree into a group neutral for analysis?
 
Thanks in advance.
 
Regards
Dorraj Oet
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Re: 6 point variable

John F Hall
Looks OK to me: it's ordinal, but we all treat this sort of stuff as scale as well.  Depends if you're looking fo structure in a lot scales or comparing sample groups on the measure.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 5:56 PM
Subject: 6 point variable

Hi all,
 
I will like to ask if the following variable can be classified as a likert scale variable for 2-indepedent t-test or correlation usage.
 
1-Strongly Disagree
2-Disagree
3-Somewhat Disagree
4-Somewhat Agree
5-Agree
6-Strongly Agree
 
If this variable is not considered as one, can I recode the somewhat disagree and somewhat agree into a group neutral for analysis?
 
Thanks in advance.
 
Regards
Dorraj Oet
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Re: 6 point variable

Wilhelm Landerholm | Queue
Hi!
I do not agree with John.
Just because you encode the data it does not mean that you get "full benefits".
If you Google on this, it is difficult to find a statistician who would recommend you to calculate mean or standard deviation of ordinal data.

Tips: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Level_of_measurement

All the best

Wilhelm (Wille) Landerholm
+46-735-460000


Queue/STATB 
Making sense of data
BOX 92 | 162 12 Vallingby | Sweden



2010/8/4 John F Hall <[hidden email]>
Looks OK to me: it's ordinal, but we all treat this sort of stuff as scale as well.  Depends if you're looking fo structure in a lot scales or comparing sample groups on the measure.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 5:56 PM
Subject: 6 point variable

Hi all,
 
I will like to ask if the following variable can be classified as a likert scale variable for 2-indepedent t-test or correlation usage.
 
1-Strongly Disagree
2-Disagree
3-Somewhat Disagree
4-Somewhat Agree
5-Agree
6-Strongly Agree
 
If this variable is not considered as one, can I recode the somewhat disagree and somewhat agree into a group neutral for analysis?
 
Thanks in advance.
 
Regards
Dorraj Oet

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Re: 6 point variable

Bruce Weaver
Administrator
In reply to this post by Jarrod Teo-2
DorraJ Oet wrote
Hi all,

I will like to ask if the following variable can be classified as a likert scale variable for 2-indepedent t-test or correlation usage.

1-Strongly Disagree
2-Disagree
3-Somewhat Disagree
4-Somewhat Agree
5-Agree
6-Strongly Agree

If this variable is not considered as one, can I recode the somewhat disagree and somewhat agree into a group neutral for analysis?

Thanks in advance.

Regards

Dorraj Oet

A single item does not constitute a Likert scale, regardless of whether there is a "neutral" point in the middle.  A Likert scale is the mean or sum of several Likert-type items.  E.g.,

   http://psychology.about.com/od/lindex/g/likert-scale.htm

IMO, using parametric procedures on individual Likert-type items is far more likely to be problematic than is using them on proper Likert scales (i.e., sums or means of several such items).

But having said that...

In another recent thread, I mentioned a guideline I like to use:  If it is fair and honest to use means and SDs descriptively, then parametric procedures should also work reasonably well.  So if I was trying to decide whether I could use a t-test on your item, I'd probably start by plotting a pair of histograms, one for each group.  If I saw two distributions that looked pretty similar, apart from a possible shift in location, then I'd feel a bit more comfortable with a t-test.  But if things other than a location shift were leaping out at me (e.g., skew in opposite directions; unimodal vs bimodal), I'd be less comfortable with the t-test, and would look for an alternative that treated the variable as ordered categories.

HTH.
--
Bruce Weaver
bweaver@lakeheadu.ca
http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/

"When all else fails, RTFM."

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Re: 6 point variable

Mike
In reply to this post by Wilhelm Landerholm | Queue
Not to belabor the point but in some respect whether one's variable is
nominal, ordinal, interval, ratio, absolute or whatever is somewhat besides
the point.  The more fundamental question is:
 
What is the nature of the population distribution from which this sample
has been drawn, if one is assuming this is a sample from a population of
values?
 
One can always calculate a mean or a standard deviation or any statistic
one wants on a group numbers but the quetion is what does such a
statistic mean?  Frederic Lord in his classic 1953 article on the "statistical
treatment of football numbers" showed that one can reach valid
conclusions about different samples of numbers even when they appear
to be only nominal (for those unfamilar with Lord's paper, the problem
is that a group of college freshman go to teacher of statistics to determine
whether they are receiving football jerseys with numbers systematically
lower than that of upper classmen -- the null hypothesis suggests that
if the numbers are assigned at random than the mean of the freshman
jerseys should not be significantly different from the mean jersey number
of the upper classmen; Tchebycheff's inequality was used as the statistical
test and it showed that the freshman mean was significantly lower).
 
The real problem, I think, is that many people would in fact treat the
6 point scale as an interval scale and then use a t-test or ANOVA or
multiple regression analysis that make assumptions way beyond one's
data is interval (e.g., follow a normal distribution).  For purposes of
descriptive analysis, one should not just get the mean but all statistics
that bear on the shape of the distribution of values.  Is the sample
symmetric around a central point (in which case the mean, median, and
mode will all be similar in value).  If the distribution is skewed, why is
it skewed?  Does the question that one is asked causing respondents
to favor one side of the rating scale over others?  And so on.
 
Finally, what sorts of inferences and/or conclusions does one want to
make.  If one is simply describing a sample of values with no interest in
a possible population from which it may have been drawn, then the sample
is the population.  Describe it adquately.  But if one is using the sample
to draw inferences about a population from which it was drawn, then which
population is being used?  What characteristics of the population is one
interested in?  How will one confirm that one's sample of values is actually
drawn from the assumed population.  And so on.
 
There are many questions to be asked and answered and both statistical
and graphical analysis may have to be done.  Stevens' distinctions may
be somewhat helfpul rules of thumb or statistical heuristics but they don't
substitute for thinking about and knowing the the data that one is working
with.  That is, be smart about your data.
 
-Mike Palij
New York University
 
Reference
 
Frederic M. Lord (1953). On the statistical treatment of footbal numbers.
American Psychologist, 8, 750-751.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: 6 point variable

Hi!
I do not agree with John.
Just because you encode the data it does not mean that you get "full benefits".
If you Google on this, it is difficult to find a statistician who would recommend you to calculate mean or standard deviation of ordinal data.

Tips: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Level_of_measurement

All the best

Wilhelm (Wille) Landerholm
+46-735-460000


Queue/STATB 
Making sense of data
BOX 92 | 162 12 Vallingby | Sweden



2010/8/4 John F Hall <[hidden email]>
Looks OK to me: it's ordinal, but we all treat this sort of stuff as scale as well.  Depends if you're looking fo structure in a lot scales or comparing sample groups on the measure.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 5:56 PM
Subject: 6 point variable

Hi all,
 
I will like to ask if the following variable can be classified as a likert scale variable for 2-indepedent t-test or correlation usage.
 
1-Strongly Disagree
2-Disagree
3-Somewhat Disagree
4-Somewhat Agree
5-Agree
6-Strongly Agree
 
If this variable is not considered as one, can I recode the somewhat disagree and somewhat agree into a group neutral for analysis?
 
Thanks in advance.
 
Regards
Dorraj Oet

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Re: 6 point variable

Jarrod Teo-2
Hi all,
 
Thank you all for your valuable responses.
 
Can I just summarize the responses as the following?
 
  1. We cannot group somewhat agree and somewhat disagree due to the fact that they are different subjects of responses.
  2. A 5-point responses (1-Strongly Disagree 2-Disagree 3-Neutral 4-Agree 5-Strongly Agree) or a 6 point responses (1-Strongly Disagree 2-Disagree 3-Somewhat Disagree 4-Somewhat Agree 5-Agree 6-Strongly Agree) is not possible to be regard as scale due to the fact that Normality has to be justified?? Is that what was meant?
  3. It is better to use another method to do a Statistical findings on a 6 point scale.
 
I shall give further details of my analysis. My client has wanted me to do a 2-independent T-test and ANOVA for a 6-point respond against gender and education level respectively. My hunch is to use a CHI-square due to the normality issue of the 6-point respond.
 
 
Do feel free to further comment on this.
 
 
 
Thanks so much in advance.
Dorraj Oet
 

Date: Wed, 4 Aug 2010 16:34:11 -0400
From: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: 6 point variable
To: [hidden email]

Not to belabor the point but in some respect whether one's variable is
nominal, ordinal, interval, ratio, absolute or whatever is somewhat besides
the point.  The more fundamental question is:
 
What is the nature of the population distribution from which this sample
has been drawn, if one is assuming this is a sample from a population of
values?
 
One can always calculate a mean or a standard deviation or any statistic
one wants on a group numbers but the quetion is what does such a
statistic mean?  Frederic Lord in his classic 1953 article on the "statistical
treatment of football numbers" showed that one can reach valid
conclusions about different samples of numbers even when they appear
to be only nominal (for those unfamilar with Lord's paper, the problem
is that a group of college freshman go to teacher of statistics to determine
whether they are receiving football jerseys with numbers systematically
lower than that of upper classmen -- the null hypothesis suggests that
if the numbers are assigned at random than the mean of the freshman
jerseys should not be significantly different from the mean jersey number
of the upper classmen; Tchebycheff's inequality was used as the statistical
test and it showed that the freshman mean was significantly lower).
 
The real problem, I think, is that many people would in fact treat the
6 point scale as an interval scale and then use a t-test or ANOVA or
multiple regression analysis that make assumptions way beyond one's
data is interval (e.g., follow a normal distribution).  For purposes of
descriptive analysis, one should not just get the mean but all statistics
that bear on the shape of the distribution of values.  Is the sample
symmetric around a central point (in which case the mean, median, and
mode will all be similar in value).  If the distribution is skewed, why is
it skewed?  Does the question that one is asked causing respondents
to favor one side of the rating scale over others?  And so on.
 
Finally, what sorts of inferences and/or conclusions does one want to
make.  If one is simply describing a sample of values with no interest in
a possible population from which it may have been drawn, then the sample
is the population.  Describe it adquately.  But if one is using the sample
to draw inferences about a population from which it was drawn, then which
population is being used?  What characteristics of the population is one
interested in?  How will one confirm that one's sample of values is actually
drawn from the assumed population.  And so on.
 
There are many questions to be asked and answered and both statistical
and graphical analysis may have to be done.  Stevens' distinctions may
be somewhat helfpul rules of thumb or statistical heuristics but they don't
substitute for thinking about and knowing the the data that one is working
with.  That is, be smart about your data.
 
-Mike Palij
New York University
 
Reference
 
Frederic M. Lord (1953). On the statistical treatment of footbal numbers.
American Psychologist, 8, 750-751.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: 6 point variable

Hi!
I do not agree with John.
Just because you encode the data it does not mean that you get "full benefits".
If you Google on this, it is difficult to find a statistician who would recommend you to calculate mean or standard deviation of ordinal data.

Tips: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Level_of_measurement

All the best

Wilhelm (Wille) Landerholm
+46-735-460000


Queue/STATB 
Making sense of data
BOX 92 | 162 12 Vallingby | Sweden



2010/8/4 John F Hall <[hidden email]>
Looks OK to me: it's ordinal, but we all treat this sort of stuff as scale as well.  Depends if you're looking fo structure in a lot scales or comparing sample groups on the measure.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 5:56 PM
Subject: 6 point variable

Hi all,
 
I will like to ask if the following variable can be classified as a likert scale variable for 2-indepedent t-test or correlation usage.
 
1-Strongly Disagree
2-Disagree
3-Somewhat Disagree
4-Somewhat Agree
5-Agree
6-Strongly Agree
 
If this variable is not considered as one, can I recode the somewhat disagree and somewhat agree into a group neutral for analysis?
 
Thanks in advance.
 
Regards
Dorraj Oet

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Re: 6 point variable

John F Hall
In reply to this post by Mike
Common sense by all means (no pun intended).   
 
Apologies to all those statisticians out there, but I would always put substance above technique. As my old boss at the SSRC Survey Unit, the late Dr Mark Abrams, used to claim, "If it's worth saying, you can say it in percentages!"   He kept a slide-rule on his desk and once, in exasperation at a slight delay in courier delivery of printout, yelled, "Computers! Computers!  It's quicker to count them by foot!"  However, I think he would like the barcharts now available in SPSS.
 
Back to Likert.  I would never rely on a single item to measure an attitude, but I have no problem with generating a correlation matrix (en route to selecting items) or calculating an attitude score from carefully selected ordinal items (regardless of the shape of their distributions).
 
On my website, 3.5  Derived variables  is a set of tutorials with fully worked examples (and critical comments) on the use of COUNT and COMPUTE to construct scores on simple attitude scales to measure "attachment to status quo" and "sexism" using data from a real survey (self-completion survey of all pupils aged 15 and 16 in one school attending on a single day).  I don't go into the methodology of how the ordinal items for "sexism" were selected (Pearson matrix, eyeball clustering, check alpha for reliability) but the results make sense.  The other (reputedly Guttman) scale was replicated from work by the late Prof Hilde Himmelweit (LSE) but I can't find a reference for it anywhere: it may have come from a draft questionnaire she used in the 1970s when she was working on young people's political attitudes.
 
   5.1     An introduction to COUNT and COMPUTE  [Page Header]  
   5.2     Teenage Attitudes (Tutorials)    [Page Header] 
   5.2.1  COUNT and COMPUTE - Preliminar­y notes [doc: 1.9 mb]
   5.2.2  Data checks 1 - Status quo [doc: 0.99 mb]
   5.2.3  The COUNT command 1 - Attachment to status quo[doc: 1.29 mb]    
  
5.2.4 
The COMPUTE command 1 - Attachment to status quo [doc: 1.28 mb]

   5.2.5  Data checks 2 - Sexism  [doc: 1.95 mb]
   5.2.6  The COUNT command 2 - Sexism  [doc: 2.33 mb] 
   5.2.7  The COMPUTE command 2 - Sexism  [doc:  1.44 mb]
 
All materials from the survey (facsimile questionnaire, raw data, SPSS saved file) are on  Fifth Form survey
if you feel you can extend the analysis.
 
John Hall
 
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Re: 6 point variable

Kornbrot, Diana
In reply to this post by Wilhelm Landerholm | Queue
Re: 6 point variable Agree
NEVER take means of ordinal data
Get proprotions for each response, then transform to normal, or logistic THEN take means, then ptransfor back to proportions
Best

Diana


On 04/08/2010 19:22, "Wilhelm Landerholm | Queue" <wl@...> wrote:

Hi!
I do not agree with John.
Just because you encode the data it does not mean that you get "full benefits".
If you Google on this, it is difficult to find a statistician who would recommend you to calculate mean or standard deviation of ordinal data.

Tips: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Level_of_measurement

All the best

Wilhelm (Wille) Landerholm <http://www.wille.nu>
+46-735-460000

Queue/STATB <http://www.qsweden.se>   
Making sense of data
BOX 92 | 162 12 Vallingby | Sweden



2010/8/4 John F Hall <johnfhall@...>
Looks OK to me: it's ordinal, but we all treat this sort of stuff as scale as well.  Depends if you're looking fo structure in a lot scales or comparing sample groups on the measure.

----- Original Message -----
 
From:  DorraJ Oet <[hidden email]>  
 
To: SPSSX-L@...
 
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 5:56  PM
 
Subject: 6 point variable
 

Hi all,
 
I will like to ask if the following  variable can be classified as a likert scale variable for 2-indepedent t-test  or correlation usage.
 
1-Strongly  Disagree
2-Disagree
3-Somewhat Disagree
4-Somewhat  Agree
5-Agree
6-Strongly Agree
 
If this  variable is not considered as one, can I recode the somewhat disagree and  somewhat agree into a group neutral for analysis?
 
Thanks in  advance.
 
Regards
Dorraj Oet





Professor Diana Kornbrot
email: 
d.e.kornbrot@...    
web:    http://web.me.com/kornbrot/KornbrotHome.html
Work
Centre for Lifespan & Chronic Illness Research, CLiCIR
School of Psychology
University of Hertfordshire
College Lane, Hatfield, Hertfordshire AL10 9AB, UK
voice:  +44 (0) 170 728 4626
Home
19 Elmhurst Avenue
London N2 0LT, UK
 voice:     +44 (0) 208 883  3657
 mobile:   +44 (0)
7855 415 425
fax:        +44 (0) 870 706 4997





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Re: 6 point variable

Wilhelm Landerholm | Queue
Hi again,

Unfortunately, there is not so much written (easily reading) on the problems around the ordinal scales. There are some around how to measure pain that is quite readable; but, I would recommend those interested to take a look at Fiorenzo Franceschini et al article Qualitative ordinal Scales: The Concept of ordinal Range

Link: http://staff.polito.it/fiorenzo.franceschini/Pubblicazioni/Qualitative%20ordinal%20scales%20the%20concept%20of%20ordinal%20range.pdf

Simple and easy to understand

Is there anyone out there who has a good article or tip on articles dealing with CLT and ordinal scales?

All the best

Wilhelm (Wille) Landerholm
+46-735-460000


Queue/STATB 
Making sense of data
BOX 92 | 162 12 Vallingby | Sweden



2010/8/5 Kornbrot, Diana <[hidden email]>
Agree
NEVER take means of ordinal data
Get proprotions for each response, then transform to normal, or logistic THEN take means, then ptransfor back to proportions
Best

Diana



On 04/08/2010 19:22, "Wilhelm Landerholm | Queue" <wl@...> wrote:

Hi!
I do not agree with John.
Just because you encode the data it does not mean that you get "full benefits".
If you Google on this, it is difficult to find a statistician who would recommend you to calculate mean or standard deviation of ordinal data.

Tips: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Level_of_measurement

All the best

Wilhelm (Wille) Landerholm <http://www.wille.nu>
+46-735-460000

Queue/STATB <http://www.qsweden.se>   

Making sense of data
BOX 92 | 162 12 Vallingby | Sweden



2010/8/4 John F Hall <johnfhall@...>
Looks OK to me: it's ordinal, but we all treat this sort of stuff as scale as well.  Depends if you're looking fo structure in a lot scales or comparing sample groups on the measure.

----- Original Message -----
 
From:  DorraJ Oet <[hidden email]>  
 
To: SPSSX-L@...
 
Sent: Wednesday, August 04, 2010 5:56  PM
 
Subject: 6 point variable
 

Hi all,
 
I will like to ask if the following  variable can be classified as a likert scale variable for 2-indepedent t-test  or correlation usage.
 
1-Strongly  Disagree
2-Disagree
3-Somewhat Disagree
4-Somewhat  Agree
5-Agree
6-Strongly Agree
 
If this  variable is not considered as one, can I recode the somewhat disagree and  somewhat agree into a group neutral for analysis?
 
Thanks in  advance.
 
Regards
Dorraj Oet





Professor Diana Kornbrot
email: 
d.e.kornbrot@...    
web:    http://web.me.com/kornbrot/KornbrotHome.html
Work
Centre for Lifespan & Chronic Illness Research, CLiCIR
School of Psychology
University of Hertfordshire
College Lane, Hatfield, Hertfordshire AL10 9AB, UK
voice:  +44 (0) 170 728 4626
Home
19 Elmhurst Avenue
London N2 0LT, UK
 voice:     +44 (0) 208 883  3657
 mobile:   +44 (0)
7855 415 425
fax:        +44 (0) 870 706 4997






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Re: inexpensive 'home' version? - a suggestion for SPSS-IBM

Enzmann
In reply to this post by Marta Garcia-Granero
Maria,

I can understand how you feel being forced to abandon a tool that you
are proficient in using. But I believe that once you started using Stata
seriously you will find that in many respects (perhaps not all) it is
superior to SPSS, and on the long run you won't regret it. I used SPSS
since about 1980 (Mainframe SPSS-X, SPSS-PC, and versions 6 up to 15)
and switched to Stata because I attended workshops for advanced methods
that were not possible to use with SPSS (gllamm, analyzes of count data,
survey analyses). Since about two years I'm using SPSS only
occasionally, and when I do I am happy that I made the move to Stata.
Many of my colleagues are still using SPSS, but more and more are moving
to Stata, too. To my mind R is very interesting and promising but still
not really an alternative because it takes much more programming skills
than most people can afford to develop or invest.

Of course, being forced to switch is a bad thing - it kills curiosity,
enthusiasm, pleasure, and its a waste of your expertise. Although this
should not happen, there is also a bright side to it: You will become
more flexible in choosing the tools that are suited best for the problem
at hand.

I recommend to read the (to my mind) fair comparison of SAS, SPSS, and
Stata (with a short excursion to R) - although some years old there are
some very good arguments to be considered seriously when making a choice
between different packages:

http://www.ats.ucla.edu/stat/TechnicalReports/number1_editedFeb_2_2007/ucla_ATSstat_tr1_1.1_0207.pdf

Yours,
Dirk

Marta García-Granero wrote:

>Hi everybody:
>
> Perhaps SPSS 15 could be saved from extinction and turned into that
> cheaper home version some people is asking for.
>
> How I wish it was that way! University of Navarra will abandon SPSS
> absolutely (not even one individual license) by June 2011. It looks like
> being charged a lot for SPSS 15 (without any technical support) for
> years, and the fact that we will have to upgrade (like it or not), even
> though PASW/SPSS 18 doesn't run OK on campus computers, was simply too
> much. We will switch to Stata.
>
> I have always insisted in this forum that students don't need to use the
> newest and brand new version of SPSS. SSPS 15 is reasonably stable, and
> powerful enough for basic statistics teaching (descriptive, Student t
> test, oneway- twoway- ANOVA, correlation, regression and contingency
> tables analyses).
>
> If SPSS keeps on loosing universities, they will finally loose a lot of
> graduated people, that will decide to use other statistical software  in
> their jobs (since they did not learn how to use SPSS at their
> universities).
>
> I'm really sad to have to stop using SPSS after 2011. I have been a SPSS
> user for 20 years, but I will not be able to afford one individual
> license for myself after the University switches to Stata. I really wish
> there was a inexpensive home version of SPSS I could by for private use.
> SPSS 15 deserves being saved from extinction.
>
> Best regards,
> Marta GG
>
> (soon a Stata user)

========================================
Dr. Dirk Enzmann
Institute of Criminal Sciences
Dept. of Criminology
Rothenbaumchaussee 33
D-20148 Hamburg
Germany

phone: +49-(0)40-42838.7498 (office)
        +49-(0)40-42838.4591 (Mrs Billon)
fax:   +49-(0)40-42838.2344
email: [hidden email]
http://www2.jura.uni-hamburg.de/instkrim/kriminologie/Mitarbeiter/Enzmann/Enzmann.html
========================================

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A defense of SPSS pricing (was: inexpensive 'home' version?)

Steve Simon, P.Mean Consulting
In reply to this post by Peter A. Neenan, Ph.D.
The following message by Peter A. Neenan, Ph.D. created a flurry of
responses:

> Are there any inexpensive 'home' or 'basic' versions of SPSS for
> individuals who are not affiliated with an academic institution?  I
> know there is a 'student' version--or there used to be--but one had
> to be enrolled or otherwise affilliated with an academic institution
> to purchase it.  Any suggestions?

Many of the messages in response to Dr. Neenan's message have been
critical of the pricing model for SPSS and have suggested a special much
lower price for individuals. In the spirit of debate, let me offer a
contrarian viewpoint.

I don't think that any of us on this list have an appreciation of the
big picture. In the world of software where things change very rapidly,
we have seen continual and regular success for SPSS (and SAS for that
matter) over a span of more than four decades. The pricing structure for
SPSS has been pretty consistent, and they make a ton of money.

The problem with a special low price version for people like you and me
is that it would cannibalize all their current sales. You can argue,
what about Stata? What about R? Those are different products, and they
should have different prices. If IBM adopted the Stata pricing policy,
how do you know that they wouldn't take a very successful product and
drive it to ruin?

Oh sure, cut the price and sales go way up. But do any of us understand
the market for statistical software well enough to predict whether the
increase in volume will make up for the loss in revenues. I don't think
so. The folks at SPSS (and at IBM even more so) are survivors who have
continued to succeed in a mercurial market. Maybe they are making the
wrong call here, but given their access to marketing data and their
previous track record, I am extremely reluctant to second guess them.

Don't get me wrong. I'd be thrilled if SPSS lowered their prices. And I
use R largely because of its price. You can't ignore price when picking
a package (or for that matter, ignore the difference between a flat out
purchase versus a yearly license fee). I just think that some of the
arguments that SPSS should lower their prices are a bit naive. It's sort
of like telling Jaguar that they should sell all their cars at the price
of a Honda Civic.

You can also make the argument that Stata is superior, but I find the
two packages almost impossible to compare. I use both. Stata is better
for some people and SPSS is better for other people.

I have not bought SPSS for my private consulting business, but I am very
grateful that at my part-time job at UMKC, that they have made the
commitment to pay for SPSS, and I recommend SPSS to a lot of people at
UMKC. I'm thinking about writing a second book,
  * http://www.pmean.com/10/SecondBook.html
and if I can convince a publisher to print it, I will use SPSS in all my
examples.

Other than how it affect me directly, I don't know if the SPSS pricing
model is good or bad. I don't think any of the rest of you do either.

The only comment I will say with certainty is that it is a mistake for
any one of us to become too dependent on a single statistical package.
If arguments about statistical packages amount to a religious fervor,
count me in among the polytheists.

Steve Simon, Standard Disclaimer
Sign up for The Monthly Mean, the newsletter that
dares to call itself "average" at www.pmean.com/news
"Data entry and data management issues with examples
in IBM SPSS," Tuesday, August 24, 11am-noon CDT.
Free webinar. Details at www.pmean.com/webinars

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Re: 6 point variable

Kornbrot, Diana
In reply to this post by Jarrod Teo-2
Re: 6 point variable In the event you want to relate a yes- no variable (buy or not buy) to you ordinal Likert item then you probably get most information from a simple contingency table of frequencie
                            buy         no buy
St agree            f11          f12
Agr                    f21          f22
Neutral              f31          f32
Disag                f41          f42
Str dosage        f51          f52
Then perform a chi-square test
This will tell you which responses result in most buy decisions. It will also tell you whether you gain more by converting agree to strongly agree, or neutral to agree

In my view you would be better off with strongly like, like, neutral, dislike strongly dislike than the ghastly agree format
Best

Diana


Professor Diana Kornbrot
email:  
d.e.kornbrot@... <http://d.e.kornbrot@...>    
web:    http://web.me.com/kornbrot/KornbrotHome.html
Work
Centre for Lifespan & Chronic Illness Research, CLiCIR
School of Psychology
University of Hertfordshire
College Lane, Hatfield, Hertfordshire AL10 9AB, UK
voice:  +44 (0) 170 728 4626
Home
19 Elmhurst Avenue
London N2 0LT, UK
 voice:     +44 (0) 208 883  3657
 mobile:   +44 (0)
7855 415 425
fax:        +44 (0) 870 706 4997





      



Professor Diana Kornbrot
email: 
d.e.kornbrot@...    
web:    http://web.me.com/kornbrot/KornbrotHome.html
Work
Centre for Lifespan & Chronic Illness Research, CLiCIR
School of Psychology
University of Hertfordshire
College Lane, Hatfield, Hertfordshire AL10 9AB, UK
voice:  +44 (0) 170 728 4626
Home
19 Elmhurst Avenue
London N2 0LT, UK
 voice:     +44 (0) 208 883  3657
 mobile:   +44 (0)
7855 415 425
fax:        +44 (0) 870 706 4997





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