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traffic

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John F Hall

Re: traffic

King

If it's blue one, it's probably worth a fortune.

John

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
King Douglas
Sent: 03 May 2013 13:53
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: +44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> 605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> <mailto:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> <mailto:

> SPSSX-L@.UGA

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: (650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
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> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
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>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

> <mailto:

> LISTSERV@.UGA

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> LISTSERV@.UGA

> <mailto:

> LISTSERV@.UGA

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

John F Hall

Re: traffic

In reply to this post by Art Kendall

When I first used a computer (an English Electric KDF9) at Salford in 1964, it used 8-hole paper tape for input and output. It occupied a room the size of a small house and you had to run the gauntlet of the Maths Dept to get near it, but it helped to cultivate the operators.

I wrote one the very first general programs in Algol for to process survey data and produce simple tabulations and statistics. It took about 40 minutes to produce one small cross-tab. Algol was just like writing Latin prose: perhaps SPSS should have Latin as a language?

Have a look at the first slide-show in my Old Dog, Old Tricks paper. (http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/old-dog-old-tricks-using-spss-syntax-to-beat-the-mouse-trap.html ) There are photos of paper tape, a paper punch, a card, a card-punch and a card-sorter. (Oh, and a typewriter!)

John F Hall (Mr)

[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 03 May 2013 16:13
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

it is a machine to put rectangular holes in 80 column cards.
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/ibm100/us/en/icons/punchcard/
I believe it was used for the 1930 census.

Art Kendall

Social Research Consultants

On 5/3/2013 9:22 AM, J. R. Carroll [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:

Art,

What _/IS/_ that? Aren't we talking about computers? That looks like some sort of bizarro abacus.

-j
----

J. R. Carroll
Cell: (650) 776-6613
www.jrcresearch.net
www.ontvp.com
Email: [hidden email]
[hidden email]
[hidden email]
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Art Kendall <[hidden email]> wrote:
I have only been using Nabble recently. I thought we could add attachments, but I guess they did not come through.
Ah how much easier it would be if UGA used newer versions of LISTSERV!
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 8:39 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Like what?

King

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall

Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 7:10 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
did it look like this?
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 7:54 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: <a href="<a href="tel:%2B44%201224%20273350">tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" value="+441224273350" target="_blank">+44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> <a href="<a href="tel:605-677-6497">tel:605-677-6497" value="+16056776497" target="_blank">605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: <a href="<a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613">tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" value="+16507766613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
> discussion
> below:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571987
> 2.html To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlSer
> vlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&
> amp;base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.templat
> e.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrum
> bs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3A
> email.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml>
>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
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[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
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If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Swank, Paul R

Re: traffic

In reply to this post by Art Kendall

I am not far behind you. My first computer experience was on my college’s hand-me-down IBM360. It was the only computer they had and it was used during the day for administrative work. The poor students, myself included, had to wait at the door until the operator went home and then we had all night to run our programs, which were entered through a teletype. I remember running numerical integration methods where we would sit and a smoke/cup of coffee in between iterations, which printed out on a line printer at a rate of about 1 per minute or two. I programmed my first Analysis of Variance on that machine for my Psych Professor. That was about 1972. And yes, David, we are old. However, I suspect you are no spring chicken either.

Paul

Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor

Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences

School of Public Health

University of Texas Health Science Center Houston

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 6:28 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

When I first started using computers in 1970, we did not start with cards. We had Teletypes (TTYs) at 110 baud. Dial in was from each university department.
in 1971, I went to the computer and learned that "large" files could be put on cards rather than typed.
To create a file you had to have cards to wrap around your file contents something like
$login 123456.1234
$password something
$deck filename.ext
data cards
$eod
This put the file in your directory.
If you put commands on cards they were identical to the commands you would put on the TTY.
Batch jobs like this could take up to 30 minutes until the printouts were available.

If you wanted to use magtape, it could be 4 to 6 minutes from the time you typed a MOUNT command until the tape was mounted and you could then read it or send a "rewind" or "skip" etc.

In 1972 SPSS was made available on DEC. You had to key <tab> between the command and the options or just <tab> before continuations. I had a high speed (300baud) modem.

In 1973 I started to use other brands of computers one brand had this stuff call JCL. On those systems everything was on cards. (some of those systems were still working that way in 1990! The faster places were 6 hours before you had a printout. If your data was on tape it could be overnight. It was about 25% of the total for a client to buy (computer time + consultant time) at a university or organization with a DEC system than it was to pay only for consultant time and use the free computer at their own universities.

Art Kendall

Social Research Consultants

On 5/3/2013 2:50 AM, Lemon, John S. [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site, usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out; you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: +44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> 605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: (650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
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>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
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> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
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> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion
> below:
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> To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
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> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719878.html>
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-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in abyssum?"
--
View this message in context: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
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View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Angie Carrico

Re: traffic

In reply to this post by John F Hall

"Don't get it right, get it written" - I think I can use that reminder sometimes.

Thanks all, for giving me an appreciation for what I have - no more griping (ok...less griping...let's be realistic) when the network goes down. Loving the history lesson.

On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 1:53 PM, John F Hall <[hidden email]> wrote:

When I first used a computer (an English Electric KDF9) at Salford in 1964, it used 8-hole paper tape for input and output. It occupied a room the size of a small house and you had to run the gauntlet of the Maths Dept to get near it, but it helped to cultivate the operators.

I wrote one the very first general programs in Algol for to process survey data and produce simple tabulations and statistics. It took about 40 minutes to produce one small cross-tab. Algol was just like writing Latin prose: perhaps SPSS should have Latin as a language?

Have a look at the first slide-show in my Old Dog, Old Tricks paper. (http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/old-dog-old-tricks-using-spss-syntax-to-beat-the-mouse-trap.html ) There are photos of paper tape, a paper punch, a card, a card-punch and a card-sorter. (Oh, and a typewriter!)

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 03 May 2013 16:13
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
it is a machine to put rectangular holes in 80 column cards.
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/ibm100/us/en/icons/punchcard/
I believe it was used for the 1930 census.
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 9:22 AM, J. R. Carroll [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Art,

What _/IS/_ that? Aren't we talking about computers? That looks like some sort of bizarro abacus.

-j
----

J. R. Carroll

Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" target="_blank" value="+16507766613">(650) 776-6613

www.jrcresearch.net

www.ontvp.com
Email: [hidden email]

[hidden email]

[hidden email]
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Art Kendall <[hidden email]> wrote:
I have only been using Nabble recently. I thought we could add attachments, but I guess they did not come through.
Ah how much easier it would be if UGA used newer versions of LISTSERV!
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 8:39 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Like what?

King

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall

Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 7:10 AM

To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
did it look like this?
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 7:54 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: <a href="<a href="tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" target="_blank">tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" value="<a href="tel:%2B441224273350" target="_blank" value="+441224273350">+441224273350" target="_blank"><a href="tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" target="_blank" value="+441224273350">+44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> <a href="<a href="tel:605-677-6497" target="_blank">tel:605-677-6497" value="<a href="tel:%2B16056776497" target="_blank" value="+16056776497">+16056776497" target="_blank"><a href="tel:605-677-6497" target="_blank" value="+16056776497">605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: <a href="<a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" target="_blank">tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" value="<a href="tel:%2B16507766613" target="_blank" value="+16507766613">+16507766613" target="_blank"><a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" target="_blank" value="+16507766613">(650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
> discussion
> below:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571987
> 2.html To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlSer
> vlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&
> amp;base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.templat
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> bs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3A
> email.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml>
>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

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View this message in context: Re: traffic
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--
Angela Carrico
Director of Institutional Research
Southwestern Michigan College
58900 Cherry Grove Rd
Dowagiac MI 49047
1-800-456-8675, ext. 1323

John F Hall

Re: traffic

In reply to this post by Art Kendall

I’ve got a first edition of the 1980 manual for SCSS (the orange one, in hardback): fat lot of use that is now. Had a grant to develop a path analysis program compatible with SPSS: it worked beautifully, but SSRC pulled the funding before we could circulate it (it would have been free). AFAIK Amos now does the same thing.

John F Hall (Mr)

[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

PS The paper tape program was later modified at Birmingham to work on a departmental PDP11. That’s where I met a load of engineers, one of whom had a program which used the holes on the paper tape to simulate sine waves travelling backwards in a traffic jam (vai a movie).

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 03 May 2013 14:50
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

I have only been using Nabble recently. I thought we could add attachments, but I guess they did not come through.
Ah how much easier it would be if UGA used newer versions of LISTSERV!

Art Kendall

Social Research Consultants

On 5/3/2013 8:39 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:

Like what?

King

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 7:10 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
did it look like this?
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 7:54 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: +44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> 605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: (650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
> discussion
> below:
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> 2.html To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
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> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlSer
> vlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&
> amp;base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.templat
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>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
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Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
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[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
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For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
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If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Nirit Avnimelech

Re: traffic

In reply to this post by Angie Carrico

Did anyone here use knitting needles for crosstabulation? (this is not a joke; those who have done it will know!)

Nirit (not considering herself that old, but offspring tend to disagree)

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Angie Carrico
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 10:12 PM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

"Don't get it right, get it written" - I think I can use that reminder sometimes.

Thanks all, for giving me an appreciation for what I have - no more griping (ok...less griping...let's be realistic) when the network goes down. Loving the history lesson.

On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 1:53 PM, John F Hall <[hidden email]> wrote:

John F Hall (Mr)

[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 03 May 2013 16:13
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

it is a machine to put rectangular holes in 80 column cards.
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/ibm100/us/en/icons/punchcard/
I believe it was used for the 1930 census.

Art Kendall

Social Research Consultants

On 5/3/2013 9:22 AM, J. R. Carroll [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:

Art,

What _/IS/_ that? Aren't we talking about computers? That looks like some sort of bizarro abacus.

-j
----

J. R. Carroll
Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
www.jrcresearch.net
www.ontvp.com
Email: [hidden email]
[hidden email]
[hidden email]
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Art Kendall <[hidden email]> wrote:
I have only been using Nabble recently. I thought we could add attachments, but I guess they did not come through.
Ah how much easier it would be if UGA used newer versions of LISTSERV!
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 8:39 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Like what?

King

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall

Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 7:10 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
did it look like this?
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 7:54 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" value="+441224273350" target="_blank">+44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> <a href="tel:605-677-6497" value="+16056776497" target="_blank">605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" value="+16507766613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
> discussion
> below:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571987
> 2.html To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlSer
> vlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&
> amp;base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.templat
> e.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrum
> bs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3A
> email.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml>
>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
NAML

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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

--
Angela Carrico
Director of Institutional Research
Southwestern Michigan College
58900 Cherry Grove Rd
Dowagiac MI 49047
1-800-456-8675, ext. 1323

Mark Miller

Re: traffic

Ah...Yes ... Edge-Punched cards.

BEFORE personal computers, was a handy way to do

preliminary analysis while doing fieldwork.

... Mark Miller

On Sat, May 4, 2013 at 9:43 AM, Nirit Avnim <[hidden email]> wrote:

Did anyone here use knitting needles for crosstabulation? (this is not a joke; those who have done it will know!)

Nirit (not considering herself that old, but offspring tend to disagree)

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Angie Carrico
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 10:12 PM

To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

"Don't get it right, get it written" - I think I can use that reminder sometimes.

Thanks all, for giving me an appreciation for what I have - no more griping (ok...less griping...let's be realistic) when the network goes down. Loving the history lesson.
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 1:53 PM, John F Hall <[hidden email]> wrote:
When I first used a computer (an English Electric KDF9) at Salford in 1964, it used 8-hole paper tape for input and output. It occupied a room the size of a small house and you had to run the gauntlet of the Maths Dept to get near it, but it helped to cultivate the operators.

I wrote one the very first general programs in Algol for to process survey data and produce simple tabulations and statistics. It took about 40 minutes to produce one small cross-tab. Algol was just like writing Latin prose: perhaps SPSS should have Latin as a language?

Have a look at the first slide-show in my Old Dog, Old Tricks paper. (http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/old-dog-old-tricks-using-spss-syntax-to-beat-the-mouse-trap.html ) There are photos of paper tape, a paper punch, a card, a card-punch and a card-sorter. (Oh, and a typewriter!)

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 03 May 2013 16:13
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
it is a machine to put rectangular holes in 80 column cards.
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/ibm100/us/en/icons/punchcard/
I believe it was used for the 1930 census.
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 9:22 AM, J. R. Carroll [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Art,

What _/IS/_ that? Aren't we talking about computers? That looks like some sort of bizarro abacus.

-j
----

J. R. Carroll

Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
www.jrcresearch.net

www.ontvp.com
Email: [hidden email]

[hidden email]
[hidden email]
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Art Kendall <[hidden email]> wrote:
I have only been using Nabble recently. I thought we could add attachments, but I guess they did not come through.
Ah how much easier it would be if UGA used newer versions of LISTSERV!
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 8:39 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Like what?

King

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall

Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 7:10 AM

To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
did it look like this?
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 7:54 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" value="+441224273350" target="_blank">+44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> <a href="tel:605-677-6497" value="+16056776497" target="_blank">605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" value="+16507766613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
> discussion
> below:
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> 2.html To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
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> vlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&
> amp;base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.templat
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> bs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3A
> email.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml>
>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
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[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

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NAML
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
--
Angela Carrico
Director of Institutional Research
Southwestern Michigan College
58900 Cherry Grove Rd
Dowagiac MI 49047
1-800-456-8675, ext. 1323

John F Hall

Re: traffic

For the enlightenment of our younger members and a nostalgic treat for the rest of us:

Robert V Williams

Punched cards: a brief tutorial

Computing Now

(No date: no pictures unless you are a member)

http://www.computer.org/portal/web/computingnow/annals/extras/cardsvol24n2

Denis H Ward (National Coal Board)

The use of edge-punched cards in statistical computation

Journal of the Royal Statistical Society. Series C (Applied Statistics)
Vol. 8, No. 2 (Jun., 1959), pp. 104-113

(Free to read on-line, but you have to register with MyJSTOR)

http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2985546?uid=3738016&uid=2129&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&sid=21102158168321

. . . and I saved the best until last.

Douglas W Jones (University of Iowa)

Punched cards

http://homepage.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/cards/

. . especially

Punched cards: a brief illustrated technical history

http://www.divms.uiowa.edu/~jones/cards/history.html

John F Hall (Mr)

[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

PS Don’t forget my slide-show:

Survey processing before SPSS

(link from page http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/old-dog-old-tricks-using-spss-syntax-to-beat-the-mouse-trap.html )

Best tools are still pencil, paper and brain.

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Mark Miller
Sent: 05 May 2013 00:46
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Ah...Yes ... Edge-Punched cards.

BEFORE personal computers, was a handy way to do

preliminary analysis while doing fieldwork.

... Mark Miller

On Sat, May 4, 2013 at 9:43 AM, Nirit Avnim <[hidden email]> wrote:

Did anyone here use knitting needles for crosstabulation? (this is not a joke; those who have done it will know!)

Nirit (not considering herself that old, but offspring tend to disagree)

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Angie Carrico
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 10:12 PM

To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

"Don't get it right, get it written" - I think I can use that reminder sometimes.

Thanks all, for giving me an appreciation for what I have - no more griping (ok...less griping...let's be realistic) when the network goes down. Loving the history lesson.

On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 1:53 PM, John F Hall <[hidden email]> wrote:

John F Hall (Mr)

[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 03 May 2013 16:13
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

it is a machine to put rectangular holes in 80 column cards.
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/ibm100/us/en/icons/punchcard/
I believe it was used for the 1930 census.

Art Kendall

Social Research Consultants

On 5/3/2013 9:22 AM, J. R. Carroll [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:

Art,

What _/IS/_ that? Aren't we talking about computers? That looks like some sort of bizarro abacus.

-j
----

J. R. Carroll
Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
www.jrcresearch.net
www.ontvp.com
Email: [hidden email]
[hidden email]
[hidden email]
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Art Kendall <[hidden email]> wrote:
I have only been using Nabble recently. I thought we could add attachments, but I guess they did not come through.
Ah how much easier it would be if UGA used newer versions of LISTSERV!
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 8:39 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Like what?

King

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall

Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 7:10 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
did it look like this?
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 7:54 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" value="+441224273350" target="_blank">+44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> <a href="tel:605-677-6497" value="+16056776497" target="_blank">605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" value="+16507766613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
> discussion
> below:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571987
> 2.html To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlSer
> vlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&
> amp;base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.templat
> e.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrum
> bs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3A
> email.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml>
>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden email]
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

--
Angela Carrico
Director of Institutional Research
Southwestern Michigan College
58900 Cherry Grove Rd
Dowagiac MI 49047
1-800-456-8675, ext. 1323

Art Kendall

Re: traffic

That history missed some of the earlier years.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Punched_card

The machine in the picture I posted was after the 1928 introduction of the "IBM" card but before the electric keypunch.

Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

On 5/5/2013 2:12 AM, John F Hall [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:

For the enlightenment of our younger members and a nostalgic treat for the rest of us:

Robert V Williams

Punched cards: a brief tutorial

Computing Now

(No date: no pictures unless you are a member)

http://www.computer.org/portal/web/computingnow/annals/extras/cardsvol24n2

Denis H Ward (National Coal Board)

The use of edge-punched cards in statistical computation

Journal of the Royal Statistical Society. Series C (Applied Statistics)
Vol. 8, No. 2 (Jun., 1959), pp. 104-113

(Free to read on-line, but you have to register with MyJSTOR)

http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2985546?uid=3738016&uid=2129&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&sid=21102158168321

. . . and I saved the best until last.

Douglas W Jones (University of Iowa)

Punched cards

http://homepage.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/cards/

. . especially

Punched cards: a brief illustrated technical history

http://www.divms.uiowa.edu/~jones/cards/history.html

John F Hall (Mr)

[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

PS Don’t forget my slide-show:

Survey processing before SPSS

(link from page http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/old-dog-old-tricks-using-spss-syntax-to-beat-the-mouse-trap.html )

Best tools are still pencil, paper and brain.

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Mark Miller
Sent: 05 May 2013 00:46
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Ah...Yes ... Edge-Punched cards.

BEFORE personal computers, was a handy way to do

preliminary analysis while doing fieldwork.

... Mark Miller
On Sat, May 4, 2013 at 9:43 AM, Nirit Avnim <[hidden email]> wrote:
Did anyone here use knitting needles for crosstabulation? (this is not a joke; those who have done it will know!)

Nirit (not considering herself that old, but offspring tend to disagree)

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Angie Carrico
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 10:12 PM

To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

"Don't get it right, get it written" - I think I can use that reminder sometimes.

Thanks all, for giving me an appreciation for what I have - no more griping (ok...less griping...let's be realistic) when the network goes down. Loving the history lesson.
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 1:53 PM, John F Hall <[hidden email]> wrote:
When I first used a computer (an English Electric KDF9) at Salford in 1964, it used 8-hole paper tape for input and output. It occupied a room the size of a small house and you had to run the gauntlet of the Maths Dept to get near it, but it helped to cultivate the operators.

I wrote one the very first general programs in Algol for to process survey data and produce simple tabulations and statistics. It took about 40 minutes to produce one small cross-tab. Algol was just like writing Latin prose: perhaps SPSS should have Latin as a language?

Have a look at the first slide-show in my Old Dog, Old Tricks paper. (http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/old-dog-old-tricks-using-spss-syntax-to-beat-the-mouse-trap.html ) There are photos of paper tape, a paper punch, a card, a card-punch and a card-sorter. (Oh, and a typewriter!)

John F Hall (Mr)

[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]

Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com

Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 03 May 2013 16:13
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
it is a machine to put rectangular holes in 80 column cards.
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/ibm100/us/en/icons/punchcard/
I believe it was used for the 1930 census.
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 9:22 AM, J. R. Carroll [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Art,

What _/IS/_ that? Aren't we talking about computers? That looks like some sort of bizarro abacus.

-j
----

J. R. Carroll

Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613

www.jrcresearch.net

www.ontvp.com

Email: [hidden email]

[hidden email]

[hidden email]
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Art Kendall <[hidden email]> wrote:
I have only been using Nabble recently. I thought we could add attachments, but I guess they did not come through.
Ah how much easier it would be if UGA used newer versions of LISTSERV!
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 8:39 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Like what?

King

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall

Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 7:10 AM

To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
did it look like this?
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 7:54 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" value="+441224273350" target="_blank">+44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> <a href="tel:605-677-6497" value="+16056776497" target="_blank">605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" value="+16507766613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
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> below:
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> 2.html To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlSer
> vlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&
> amp;base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.templat
> e.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrum
> bs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3A
> email.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml>
>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
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[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
commands to manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:

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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
--
Angela Carrico
Director of Institutional Research
Southwestern Michigan College
58900 Cherry Grove Rd
Dowagiac MI 49047
1-800-456-8675, ext. 1323
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

John F Hall

Re: traffic

I knew that some statistics had racist origins, but not that the Nazis used Hollerith cards to identify Gypsies and Jews.

http://design.osu.edu/carlson/history/PDFs/lubar-hollerith.pdf

Bit of salutary additional reading for students?

John Hall

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 05 May 2013 13:31
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Art Kendall

Social Research Consultants

On 5/5/2013 2:12 AM, John F Hall [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:

For the enlightenment of our younger members and a nostalgic treat for the rest of us:

Robert V Williams
Punched cards: a brief tutorial
Computing Now
(No date: no pictures unless you are a member)
http://www.computer.org/portal/web/computingnow/annals/extras/cardsvol24n2

Denis H Ward (National Coal Board)
The use of edge-punched cards in statistical computation
Journal of the Royal Statistical Society. Series C (Applied Statistics)
Vol. 8, No. 2 (Jun., 1959), pp. 104-113
(Free to read on-line, but you have to register with MyJSTOR)
http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2985546?uid=3738016&uid=2129&uid=2&uid=70&uid=4&sid=21102158168321

. . . and I saved the best until last.

Douglas W Jones (University of Iowa)
Punched cards
http://homepage.cs.uiowa.edu/~jones/cards/
. . especially
Punched cards: a brief illustrated technical history
http://www.divms.uiowa.edu/~jones/cards/history.html

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

PS Don’t forget my slide-show:
Survey processing before SPSS
(link from page http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/old-dog-old-tricks-using-spss-syntax-to-beat-the-mouse-trap.html )

Best tools are still pencil, paper and brain.

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Mark Miller
Sent: 05 May 2013 00:46
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Ah...Yes ... Edge-Punched cards.
BEFORE personal computers, was a handy way to do
preliminary analysis while doing fieldwork.

... Mark Miller
On Sat, May 4, 2013 at 9:43 AM, Nirit Avnim <[hidden email]> wrote:
Did anyone here use knitting needles for crosstabulation? (this is not a joke; those who have done it will know!)

Nirit (not considering herself that old, but offspring tend to disagree)

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Angie Carrico
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 10:12 PM

To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

"Don't get it right, get it written" - I think I can use that reminder sometimes.

Thanks all, for giving me an appreciation for what I have - no more griping (ok...less griping...let's be realistic) when the network goes down. Loving the history lesson.
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 1:53 PM, John F Hall <[hidden email]> wrote:
When I first used a computer (an English Electric KDF9) at Salford in 1964, it used 8-hole paper tape for input and output. It occupied a room the size of a small house and you had to run the gauntlet of the Maths Dept to get near it, but it helped to cultivate the operators.
I wrote one the very first general programs in Algol for to process survey data and produce simple tabulations and statistics. It took about 40 minutes to produce one small cross-tab. Algol was just like writing Latin prose: perhaps SPSS should have Latin as a language?

Have a look at the first slide-show in my Old Dog, Old Tricks paper. (http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/old-dog-old-tricks-using-spss-syntax-to-beat-the-mouse-trap.html ) There are photos of paper tape, a paper punch, a card, a card-punch and a card-sorter. (Oh, and a typewriter!)

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: 03 May 2013 16:13
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
it is a machine to put rectangular holes in 80 column cards.
http://www-03.ibm.com/ibm/history/ibm100/us/en/icons/punchcard/
I believe it was used for the 1930 census.
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 9:22 AM, J. R. Carroll [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Art,

What _/IS/_ that? Aren't we talking about computers? That looks like some sort of bizarro abacus.

-j
----

J. R. Carroll
Cell: <a href="<a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613">tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
www.jrcresearch.net
www.ontvp.com
Email: [hidden email]
[hidden email]
[hidden email]
On Fri, May 3, 2013 at 8:49 AM, Art Kendall <[hidden email]> wrote:
I have only been using Nabble recently. I thought we could add attachments, but I guess they did not come through.
Ah how much easier it would be if UGA used newer versions of LISTSERV!
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 8:39 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
Like what?

King

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall

Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 7:10 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
did it look like this?
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 7:54 AM, King Douglas [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
If you are still working with cards (or want to learn), I have an SPSS
manual from 1970 that might be useful.

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
John F Hall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 2:49 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Aah! 80-column Hollerith cards, commands in 1 -15, specs in 16 -70,
numbering 71-80 (in case someone dropped the tray). All that JCL to add
before the job: for ICL machines one witty programmer produced a nursery
rhyme (does anyone still have a copy?) about the series of "Georges" we had
to learn every time a new operating system was released.

Two-hour turn-around? That was about par for LSE in the early 1970s, but at
PNL we had to wait a whole day as we depended on a courier service between
campuses (unless we went over to computer services ourselves). My unit had
a VDU connection to the CDC at ULCC, but it was two years before we even got
a single 2nd-hand card punch. For students, everything went to data-prep at
computer services on coding sheets: erros were not discovered for 24 hours
and it was another 24 before they could be corrected. We worked like this
for several years before our campus eventually got a computer lab with 16
remote VDUs, a fast server and a couple of line-printers.

We only found out about that a day before term started and we'd already
prepared class materials for the old system. Typical senior management at
faculty and institutional level!

Even with the new system, we had to teach students VMS and EDT before they
could start on SPSS. At first students kept exceeding their disk
allocations as every edition of every file was kept, but we fixed that by
restricting files to the two most recent editions. Another problem was
students printing up every file, even with errors (think of all those
trees!). We fixed that with a wonderful front end which reported errors
immediately and went back to the point in the syntax file where the error
occurred. In those days SPSS was not very good at identifying the actual
error, but at least it allowed the tutor to help if needed. The front-end
also forced students to check their output before printing, thus saving at
least a few trees.

Mind you the courses speeded up immensely as students got immediate
feed-back and job turn-round. Great for motivation: off they went in hot
pursuit of findings.

Even then I still taught students about fixed fields for both syntax and
data before tucking in to SPSS. Even now I prefer syntax to the GUI for
most basic operations: I think students klearn and retain more this way.

At least we don't have to use coding sheets any more (see:
http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/1.3.3.2a_introducti
on_to_spss_syntax.pdf

John F Hall (Mr)
[Retired academic survey researcher]

Email: [hidden email]
Website: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com
Start page: www.surveyresearch.weebly.com/spss-without-tears.html

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
Lemon, John
Sent: 03 May 2013 08:47
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and
maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you
had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and
that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard
hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site,
usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out;
you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was
released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I
remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the
releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B44%201224%20273350" value="+441224273350" target="_blank">+44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of
David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> <a href="tel:605-677-6497" value="+16056776497" target="_blank">605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:
> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:
> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: <a href="tel:%28650%29%20776-6613" value="+16507766613" target="_blank">(650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the
> discussion
> below:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571987
> 2.html To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlSer
> vlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&
> amp;base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.templat
> e.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrum
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>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp571
> 9857p5719878.html> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:
> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email
me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos
ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in
abyssum?"
--
View this message in context:
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Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
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command. To leave the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of
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The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
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=====================
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[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
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=====================
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[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
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View this message in context: Re: traffic
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View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
--
Angela Carrico
Director of Institutional Research
Southwestern Michigan College
58900 Cherry Grove Rd
Dowagiac MI 49047
1-800-456-8675, ext. 1323
If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

Garry Gelade

Re: traffic

In reply to this post by Swank, Paul R

I beat all of you.

I used a DEC LINC-8 minicomputer, which featured paper tape and a teletype as well as DECtape. We used a bit of cardboard behind one of the two DECtape drives to ensure the tape ran smoothly.

My main memory is of trying to write a program on paper tape without making a single typing error. I had yet to discover that a typing error could be ‘crossed out’ by backing up the tape and typing the equivalent of a blank (eight holes).

Thankfully the nighmares have stopped now.

Garry

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Swank, Paul R
Sent: 03 May 2013 18:54
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Paul

Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor

Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences

School of Public Health

University of Texas Health Science Center Houston

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 6:28 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Art Kendall

Social Research Consultants

On 5/3/2013 2:50 AM, Lemon, John S. [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:

How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site, usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out; you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: +44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> 605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: (650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion
> below:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719872.html
> To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrumbs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml>
>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719878.html>
> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage
> subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

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> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage
> subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email me.
---
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Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in abyssum?"
--
View this message in context: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
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=====================
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=====================
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Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

King Douglas

Re: traffic

Garry,

I could have told you about backing up the tape and overtyping blanks. I used to be a teletype operator, which was an interesting skill to learn before the ASR (automatic sending receiving) with its paper tape came along (this was in the early 60's).

My only experience with punched cards was not in programming but in reconciling large-customer bank accounts at a major bank, also in the early 60's.sorting and processing thousands of -also interesting because of the cool sorting machines. But, yes, been there, done that.

King Douglas

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Garry Gelade
Sent: Monday, May 06, 2013 5:22 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

I beat all of you.

I used a DEC LINC-8 minicomputer, which featured paper tape and a teletype as well as DECtape. We used a bit of cardboard behind one of the two DECtape drives to ensure the tape ran smoothly.

Thankfully the nighmares have stopped now.

Garry

statisticsdoc

Re: traffic

In reply to this post by Garry Gelade

Some of us remember when cut and paste was something involving scissors and glue :)

Best,

Stephen Brand

Sent from my iPhone

On May 6, 2013, at 6:22 AM, Garry Gelade <[hidden email]> wrote:

I beat all of you.

I used a DEC LINC-8 minicomputer, which featured paper tape and a teletype as well as DECtape. We used a bit of cardboard behind one of the two DECtape drives to ensure the tape ran smoothly.
My main memory is of trying to write a program on paper tape without making a single typing error. I had yet to discover that a typing error could be ‘crossed out’ by backing up the tape and typing the equivalent of a blank (eight holes).

Thankfully the nighmares have stopped now.

Garry

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Swank, Paul R
Sent: 03 May 2013 18:54
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

I am not far behind you. My first computer experience was on my college’s hand-me-down IBM360. It was the only computer they had and it was used during the day for administrative work. The poor students, myself included, had to wait at the door until the operator went home and then we had all night to run our programs, which were entered through a teletype. I remember running numerical integration methods where we would sit and a smoke/cup of coffee in between iterations, which printed out on a line printer at a rate of about 1 per minute or two. I programmed my first Analysis of Variance on that machine for my Psych Professor. That was about 1972. And yes, David, we are old. However, I suspect you are no spring chicken either.

Paul

Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences
School of Public Health
University of Texas Health Science Center Houston

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 6:28 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
When I first started using computers in 1970, we did not start with cards. We had Teletypes (TTYs) at 110 baud. Dial in was from each university department.
in 1971, I went to the computer and learned that "large" files could be put on cards rather than typed.
To create a file you had to have cards to wrap around your file contents something like
$login 123456.1234
$password something
$deck filename.ext
data cards
$eod
This put the file in your directory.
If you put commands on cards they were identical to the commands you would put on the TTY.
Batch jobs like this could take up to 30 minutes until the printouts were available.

If you wanted to use magtape, it could be 4 to 6 minutes from the time you typed a MOUNT command until the tape was mounted and you could then read it or send a "rewind" or "skip" etc.

In 1972 SPSS was made available on DEC. You had to key <tab> between the command and the options or just <tab> before continuations. I had a high speed (300baud) modem.

In 1973 I started to use other brands of computers one brand had this stuff call JCL. On those systems everything was on cards. (some of those systems were still working that way in 1990! The faster places were 6 hours before you had a printout. If your data was on tape it could be overnight. It was about 25% of the total for a client to buy (computer time + consultant time) at a university or organization with a DEC system than it was to pay only for consultant time and use the free computer at their own universities.
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 2:50 AM, Lemon, John S. [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site, usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out; you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: +44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> 605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: (650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
> If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion
> below:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719872.html
> To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=5>
> To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
> NAML<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/template/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=macro_viewer&id=instant_html%21nabble%3Aemail.naml&base=nabble.naml.namespaces.BasicNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NabbleNamespace-nabble.view.web.template.NodeNamespace&breadcrumbs=notify_subscribers%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-instant_emails%21nabble%3Aemail.naml-send_instant_email%21nabble%3Aemail.naml>
>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719878.html>
> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage
> subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to manage
> subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD

-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in abyssum?"
--
View this message in context: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
SIGNOFF SPSSX-L
For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
INFO REFCARD

The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
command. To leave the list, send the command
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For a list of commands to manage subscriptions, send the command
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If you reply to this email, your message will be added to the discussion below:
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To start a new topic under SPSSX Discussion, email [hidden email]
To unsubscribe from SPSSX Discussion, click here.
NAML

Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

John F Hall

Re: traffic

Well, like I said, you need pencil, paper and brain, but also scissors and sticky tape: have a look at slides 12, 13 and 14 in the first slide show for my 2006 Old Dog, Old Tricks presentation:

http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/slides_1_-_history_and_background.ppt (I’d never used Powerpoint before, or indeed since, so excuse the odd text placements on some slides.) Slide 16 reveals the origin of the name of the first computer I ever worked on (an English Electric KDF9).

If you want to see a real cut-and-paste job (typed at home on a typewriter as I didn't have one at work) see the questionnaire I cobbled up overnight for a1973 survey of senior girls at St Paul’s Girls’ School in London.

http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/trinians_questionnaire_feb_1973_.pdf Is a facsimile of the original self-completion questionnaire, a real scissors and sticky tape job, which I had to do at home on the end-of-project typewriter I "rescued" from the Salford Work and Home Survey in 1968! Very tight on space, so no mark-up for data capture, which had to be done later using a transfer sheet.

http://surveyresearch.weebly.com/uploads/2/9/9/8/2998485/trinians_log.pdf is a log of my titanic struggle to update 1973 SPSS syntax on a CDC 2000 to SPSS 11 for Windows in order to reconstruct the original file.

John Hall

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Stephen Brand
Sent: 06 May 2013 14:21
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

Some of us remember when cut and paste was something involving scissors and glue :)

Best,

Stephen Brand

Sent from my iPhone

On May 6, 2013, at 6:22 AM, Garry Gelade <[hidden email]> wrote:

I beat all of you.

I used a DEC LINC-8 minicomputer, which featured paper tape and a teletype as well as DECtape. We used a bit of cardboard behind one of the two DECtape drives to ensure the tape ran smoothly.
My main memory is of trying to write a program on paper tape without making a single typing error. I had yet to discover that a typing error could be ‘crossed out’ by backing up the tape and typing the equivalent of a blank (eight holes).

Thankfully the nighmares have stopped now.

Garry

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Swank, Paul R
Sent: 03 May 2013 18:54
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

I am not far behind you. My first computer experience was on my college’s hand-me-down IBM360. It was the only computer they had and it was used during the day for administrative work. The poor students, myself included, had to wait at the door until the operator went home and then we had all night to run our programs, which were entered through a teletype. I remember running numerical integration methods where we would sit and a smoke/cup of coffee in between iterations, which printed out on a line printer at a rate of about 1 per minute or two. I programmed my first Analysis of Variance on that machine for my Psych Professor. That was about 1972. And yes, David, we are old. However, I suspect you are no spring chicken either.

Paul

Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences
School of Public Health
University of Texas Health Science Center Houston

From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
Sent: Friday, May 03, 2013 6:28 AM
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic
When I first started using computers in 1970, we did not start with cards. We had Teletypes (TTYs) at 110 baud. Dial in was from each university department.
in 1971, I went to the computer and learned that "large" files could be put on cards rather than typed.
To create a file you had to have cards to wrap around your file contents something like
$login 123456.1234
$password something
$deck filename.ext
data cards
$eod
This put the file in your directory.
If you put commands on cards they were identical to the commands you would put on the TTY.
Batch jobs like this could take up to 30 minutes until the printouts were available.

If you wanted to use magtape, it could be 4 to 6 minutes from the time you typed a MOUNT command until the tape was mounted and you could then read it or send a "rewind" or "skip" etc.

In 1972 SPSS was made available on DEC. You had to key <tab> between the command and the options or just <tab> before continuations. I had a high speed (300baud) modem.

In 1973 I started to use other brands of computers one brand had this stuff call JCL. On those systems everything was on cards. (some of those systems were still working that way in 1990! The faster places were 6 hours before you had a printout. If your data was on tape it could be overnight. It was about 25% of the total for a client to buy (computer time + consultant time) at a university or organization with a DEC system than it was to pay only for consultant time and use the free computer at their own universities.
Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants
On 5/3/2013 2:50 AM, Lemon, John S. [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
How many of us learnt SPSS on punched cards ? with fixed columns 1 & 16 and maybe a two hour turnaround to discover one character was misplaced and you had to re-punch the card. Plus new versions came around every 2-3 years and that was when the bugs were fixed. Those of us with unusual/ non-standard hardware ( in our case Honeywell GCOS ) had to wait for another site, usually another university, to 'convert' the release tape and send it out; you also hoped that there was no problem with the tape the software was released on as it could take a month for the tape to cross the Atlantic. I remember it took three attempts to get a tape that would work for one of the releases.

Who says it was "the good old days" ?

Best Wishes

John S. Lemon
IT Services - Student Liaison Officer
University of Aberdeen
Edward Wright Building
Tel: +44 1224 273350

DIT news for Students

-----Original Message-----
From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of David Marso
Sent: 03 May 2013 02:15
To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: traffic

You guys all must be really old ;-)))
--

Swank, Paul R wrote
> Ahhh. I have somewhat mixed memories of version numbers!
>
> Dr. Paul R. Swank, Professor
> Health Promotion and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 9:08 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> well I I guess I was reminiscing because Saturday I brought the first
> computer that was my own. A PDT 11/150 to the recycling center.
>
>
> I have old VAX BACKUP save sets. Someone transferred them from tape to
> DVD for me. I am waiting until he unpacks the save sets to windows
> files.
>
> Then I am going to literally pull the plug on my VAX.
>
>
> [How is the mention of tapes for bringing up painful memories? Should
> I talk about 110 baud acoustic coupler modems?]
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 9:19 AM, Pietrzak, Dale wrote:
> Are you folks trying to trigger a PTSD event for me? I have worked
> diligently to forget those things - and "Pine."
>
> Dale Pietrzak, Ed.D., LPCMH, CCMHC
> Director, Office of Academic Evaluation and Assessment University of
> South Dakota Slagle Hall Room 102
> 414 East Clark Street
> 605-677-6497
>
>
>
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:

> [hidden email]

> ] On Behalf Of Art Kendall
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 8:02 AM
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> You are right. I was confusing BITNET with ARPANET.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/2/2013 8:53 AM, Mike Palij wrote:
> I think your memory might be off about BITNET. Here is the Wikipedia
> entry on it which identifies that CUNY and Yale initiated it in 1981
> on IBM mainframes; see:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitnet
> And here is CREN's view of BITNET history:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/cren-hist-fut.html
> See also:
> http://www.cren.net/cren/history.html
>
> As for DECnet, see the Wikipedia entry here:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decnet
> Although DECnet is identified as starting in 1974, it seems to me that
> it does not really connect to other networks until 1980-1982.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University

> mp26@

> <mailto:

> mp26@

> >
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Art Kendall<mailto:

> Art@

> >
> To:

> [hidden email]

> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> >
> Sent: Thursday, May 02, 2013 7:34 AM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> If I recall correctly, there was BITNET around 1978 and DECnet around
> 1976 although DECnet was more of a LAN.
>
>
>
> Art Kendall
>
> Social Research Consultants
> On 5/1/2013 8:22 PM, Mike Palij [via SPSSX Discussion] wrote:
> You can start here and work your way forward:
>
> http://info.cern.ch/hypertext/WWW/TheProject.html
>
> If you're a real glutton for punishment, start at Usenet; see:
> http://groups.google.com/group/fa.unix-wizards/browse_thread/thread/20
> 478010e2f905e4/853b59715ae4b2ff?hl=en&q=usenet#853b59715ae4b2ff
>
> Sorry, I couldn't find anything from 1979 or earlier.
>
> -Mike Palij
> New York University
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=0>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=1>
> To: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=2>
> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 7:40 PM
> Subject: Re: traffic
>
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
>
> David, can you explain Martix all over again and what RTFM means and
> how often I should apply it?
> Art/Bruce can you teach me research design from the beginning?
> JonoH, please rewrite all my wants/dreams into a mashup of Python and
> SPSS Syntax.
>
> If we gotta start over, let's just get it all over with.
>
> *shotgun to head*
>
> ///
>
> Man, if I had to do a reboot on the internet and start over, I don't
> even know where I began. In the beginning there was...? Personal pages?
> Advertisements? A restaurant? I only remember animated gifs (flaming
> skulls), rainbow hr's, interlaced jpegs, and that damn fax-like noise.
> I don't really remember 'content' being a part of the original interwebs.
>
>
> ----
> [http://jrcresearch.net/blog/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/sig.gif]
>
> J. R. Carroll
> Independent Researcher/Psychometrician through Hurtz Labs Research
> Methods, Test Development, and Statistics Python/WWW Developer
> www.jrcresearch.net<http://www.jrcresearch.net/>
> www.ontvp.com<http://www.ontvp.com>
> Cell: (650) 776-6613
> Email: [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=3>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=4>
> [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=5>
> [http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/914/697/ZA102637861.gif]&l
> t;https://www.facebook.com/J.R.Car>[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/
> en-us/files/918/121/ZA102637858.gif]<https://twitter.com/jNammer&gt
> ;[http://officeimg.vo.msecnd.net/en-us/files/739/234/ZA102637857.gif]&
> lt;http://www.linkedin.com/in/jrcarroll>
>
>
> On Wed, May 1, 2013 at 5:29 PM, David Marso <[hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=6>>
> wrote:
> Perhaps all answers have been found. The archives are complete. Our
> work is done here.
> I have reached the end of the internet. Should I start reading it
> again from the beginning?
> --------------------------
>
> bdates wrote
>> The ubiquitous 'they' are avoiding us!
>> ________________________________________
>> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=0>
>
>> ] on behalf of Bruce Weaver [
>
>> bruce.weaver@
>> ]
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 01, 2013 4:50 PM
>> To:
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=1>
>
>> Subject: Re: traffic
>>
>> I think it's just been a quiet day, Paul -- or at least it was until
>> all those vacation messages triggered by your post! ;-)
>>
>> Perhaps everyone was busy watching the second leg of Barcelona v
>> Bayern Munich. :-|
>>
>> http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/22357630
>>
>>
>>
>> Swank, Paul R wrote
>>> I have received no messages on the listserve today. ANybody else
>>> have this problem?
>>>
>>> Paul R. Swank, Ph.D., Professor
>>> Health Promotions and Behavioral Sciences School of Public Health
>>> University of Texas Health Science Center Houston
>>>
>>> =====================
>>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>>
>>> [hidden
>>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=2>
>>
>>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave
>>> the list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----
>> --
>> Bruce Weaver
>
>> bweaver@
>> http://sites.google.com/a/lakeheadu.ca/bweaver/
>
>>
>> "When all else fails, RTFM."
>>
>> NOTE: My Hotmail account is not monitored regularly.
>> To send me an e-mail, please use the address shown above.
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p57198
>> 63.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
>> Nabble.com.
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=3>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>>
>> =====================
>> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to
>
>> [hidden
>> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719878&i=4>
>
>> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
>> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
>> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
>
>
>
> -----
> Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
> Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to
> email me.
> ---
> "Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante
> porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
> Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum
> cliff in abyssum?"
> --
> View this message in context:
> http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p571986
> 5.html Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at
> Nabble.com.
>
> =====================
> To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a message to [hidden
> email]</user/SendEmail.jtp?type=node&node=5719872&i=7>
> (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
> list, send the command SIGNOFF SPSSX-L For a list of commands to
> manage subscriptions, send the command INFO REFCARD
>
>
> ________________________________
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>
> Art Kendall
> Social Research Consultants
>
> ________________________________
> View this message in context: Re:
> traffic<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719878.html>
> Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list
> archive<http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/> at
> Nabble.com.
>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

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> <mailto:

> [hidden email]

> > (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the command. To leave the
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>
> ===================== To manage your subscription to SPSSX-L, send a
> message to

> [hidden email]

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> [hidden email]

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-----
Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in abyssum?"
--
View this message in context: http://spssx-discussion.1045642.n5.nabble.com/traffic-tp5719857p5719887.html
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

=====================
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[hidden email] (not to SPSSX-L), with no body text except the
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The University of Aberdeen is a charity registered in Scotland, No SC013683.

=====================
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Art Kendall
Social Research Consultants

View this message in context: Re: traffic
Sent from the SPSSX Discussion mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

David Marso

Re: traffic

Administrator

In reply to this post by Swank, Paul R

Rather ironic that a post indicating there was no list traffic has resulted in 54 replies ;-)

Please reply to the list and not to my personal email.
Those desiring my consulting or training services please feel free to email me.
---
"Nolite dare sanctum canibus neque mittatis margaritas vestras ante porcos ne forte conculcent eas pedibus suis."
Cum es damnatorum possederunt porcos iens ut salire off sanguinum cliff in abyssum?"

123